Moderator: Dave Roberts
I have started a discussion on this matter at baptistlife.com/forums FAith and Practice. My Parents were married in Rome, Ga near the Thankful Baptist Church Ms. Wilkerson celebrates in Warmth of Other Suns.
What happened in Sanford is tragic. Still on any given day there are highly charged incidents all across America and the majority of them have a much better solution than Sanford.
What happened there was tragic and I think the Tea Party and the NRA share great deal of the blame. OTOH folks have to start talking to one another in multi race neighborhoods. There are a lot of good folks out there who can tell their neighbors we have a visitor coming in for a few weeks and he is from such and such and will not be a threat to the neighborhood. White Folks should not have to live in anxiety over the possibility of stepping on racially charged politically incorrect dynamite when there are a rash of burglaries in the neighborhood and good reason to suspect they are being committed by youth of color.
Still in no way does that apologize for what happened in Sanford.
It is no secret The Deep South lives for SEC Football and on any given Saturday of 22 odd folks on the field, 15 or more of them are of color.
The Movie the Blind Side was box office success. Friday Night lights was of critical acclaim. The University system of the SEC can go a long way toward deflating these anxieties if they work harder with the communities from which they harvest their multimillion dollar franchises each fall.
Next Panel, Have Tim Tyson of Duke on the program with Isabel Wilkerson and Michelle Norris. And have a separate program with couple Coaches from UGA, Florida and Alabama. Read Howell Raines piece, Goodbye to the Bear. Ms. Wilkerson will like that one for reference
I agree with Anthea and disagree with Anthea, which is where I always come down whenever these types of discussions ensue. When was the last time we heard about an upper class or even upper middle class African-American being gunned down in this way in this country? And yet we hear about lower to middle-class people, of all colors, being gunned down by the police and each other in America all the time.
The Trayvon tragedy occurred, apparently, because a sociopath in a state where you can carry a gun if you're a sociopath, and where there is a law on the books (thanks to the NRA)that says you can kill just about anybody if the dead guy started the fight.
The problems are not racial, they are about class (1) and the fact that we have allowed demagogue politicians and ideologue justices to foist a perverted interpretation of the second amendment on the country (2).
Does race come into it? Of course. But only insofar as the mass of us allow the capitalist elite in this country to keep pitting us against each other as a way to control the rage that we should rightly be directing against them. The masters, (admittedly mostly white but now bolstered by the African-American elites of whom Obama is the epitome)sell us the guns; sell us the idea through the media that guns can solve our problems; sell white folks the idea that young black men are crackheads and rapists and, also, sell white folks the idea that if Black folks respond with righteous indignation, they are over-responding; sell white folks the idea that no matter how poor and oppressed they are, they have no common ground with Black or other minority folks, because, guess what? they're white and that fact alone puts them ahead of the game!
But, Anthea, poor white folks are not ahead of the game, and, increasingly, they know it. We have to come together in this country, and it has to be a coming together about something other than race. The struggle to come is the class struggle, let us not let incidents like the tragedy in Sanford, FL divide us. The rich are killing us all - black, white and brown - and if we're going to fight, I think the time has come to find some new language.
The Evergreen Association of American Baptist Churches Board meeting on Saturday, March 24, 2012 asked that justice be sought in the slaying of Trayvon Martin in Florida. The Board is concerned that a young black man was targeted and undue force was used against him in whatever altercation happened the evening he was killed. The Board is also concerned that this was a case of racial profiling resulting in no arrest. In this case laws that allow someone to use deadly force against another without arrest is abuse of power. The Evergreen Association of American Baptist Churches is calling for the arrest of George Zimmerman.
I think this wasn't meant to be a call to JUST arrest George Zimmerman. Developing evidence that crimes were committed (if, as it certainly seems, they were), especially if, as video evidence suggests, police may possibly have been complicit in creating the "broken nose, etc." cover story, and prosecuting the criminals would be much more important. Zimmerman WAS arrested, taken to a police station in handcuffs, and then released without charge. I share the stated concerns of the Board, but justice demands much more than an arrest, which is perhaps not the best choice of demands in response to the concerns.
I can't understand why George Zimmerman was not arrested the night of the slaying! I pray that strong seekers of justice will never give up until justice is realized.
Good for you and the Evergreen Board!! To whom did you address your call for justice?
Such a sad reminder of how many of us do carry within us unjust feelings against one type of persons or another. I think it's a call for self-examination!
lood samples could have been collected from Zimmerman, just as they were from Martin. IMHO, the real concern, and the more dangerous criminality, if it can be proven, is police complicity in covering up the facts of the homicide. Police with impunity are a deadly threat to society.
James wrote:The critical question, under the Florida law is this, Would Trayvon have been justified in shooting Zimmerman if T had had a gun. Z was stalking T. T had a right to defend himself so even if he did hit Z he was justified under the law. So, if they had both had guns, they would have been fully justified in stageing a gunfight in the middle of the street with bullets flying in every direction. The Florida law is an exercise in thoughtless stupidity.
James wrote:The critical question, under the Florida law is this, Would Trayvon have been justified in shooting Zimmermon if T had had a gun. Z was stalking T. T had a right to defend himself so even if he did hit Z he was justified under the law. So, if they had both had guns, they would have been fully justified in stageing a gunfight in the middle of the street with bullets flying in every direction. The Florida law is an exercise in thoughtless stupidity.
James wrote:Haruo, I agree completely. This law, taken to its extreme encourages everyone to reenact his or her own shootout at the OK corral.
Dave Roberts wrote:The great tragedy here is allowing an armed, untrained citizen to play vigilante. Zimmerman is an expression of the idea that we all need a gun to protect ourselves and our neighborhoods. I am a gun owner, and I am trained to use a firearm. Do I carry one regularly? No. The reason is that if I ever pull one out, I must without question be prepared to take a life. This seems a tragedy for all concerned.
While the youth’s supporters declare in solidarity “We are all Trayvon,” the question is raised, to what extent is the United States also all George Zimmerman?
Tim Bonney wrote:It shouldn't be a racial issue David. But I believe the fact the the police didn't arrest Zimmerman for a potential crime is being viewed as a potentially racially motivated action. I personally have a hard time believing that if the colors had been reversed and that if a black man had shot a white guy that he'd not have been arrested and charged.
Dave Roberts wrote:
Much of the controversy seems to hinge on a FL law regarding rights of self-defense. I am certain that race entered the equation, but there seems much legal confusion over Zimmerman's claims of having acted under a unique FL statute. It gets messy.
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