The Guts of SBC Ideology

[Stephen Fox]

Here on the eve of Phoenix SBC David Miller's SBCVoices blog might've done the world a service with this window into the soul of current SBC.
Anthony Russo, author of the following blog in his 4th comment in the exchange following his presentation sums up pretty well seems to me how SBC currently sees their mandate in the public Square:

http://sbcvoices.com/should-christians- ... cal-views/

Later at is blog since Miller has banned dissenting views like mine at his site; at Russo's blog I may offer him some advice. Basically have him explore the coitus between Tim Lahaye and the John Birch Society in Southern California in the 50's and 60's before Pressler and Helms invited LaHaye into the SBC. See Dochuk from the Biblebelt to the Sunbelt.

[Jim]

[Ed Pettibone]

Ed: Is the question really the same today within a Democracy or a Republic, as it was in the days of Jesus under Monarchical rule?

[ET]

[Neil Heath]

[Big Daddy Weaver]

I think Russo reveals that there is a corner of SBC life just like there is a growing segment in CBF life (especially among some younger Baptists) to advocate on behalf of political disengagement.

It was just this time last year that a CBF staffer penned a post on the CBF blog harshly critical of Baptists participating in the political process, advocacy on behalf of religious liberty, etc. Brent Walker ended up penning a response to that young CBF staffer published in Report from the Capital.

When Bruce and I responded to the CBF guy (whose name slips my mind, Kris?), he admitted that he did not vote in 2008 and doesn't vote in general.

During the 2010 election cycle, a now newly minted Baylor Religion phd posted a note on Facebook, implying that political participation is a worthless cause. He didn't vote either.

Look at that guy Andrew Gardner who Stephen Fox linked to here at BL.com a few days back. Gardner wrote a column for ED.com criticizing some of the graduation prayer stuff that's been in the news. I agreed with the substance of his article. But in his conversation with Fox, Gardner noted that he was offering a moral critique for Christians absent any political implications. Gardner, a young Baptist, desires to see Baptists move away from "rights" language. Thus, Baptists need to quit claiming that we have a right to religious freedom, a right to any freedom.

[And I certainly disagree strongly with Russo and Gardner both]

I suspect though that Russo represents a smaller minority in SBC land than the growing seemingly growing voices in the Fellowship Baptist world offering similar arguments that see little to no value in political participation.

[Stephen Fox]

And Cliff Vaughn of ethicsdaily.com would differ from Weaver and Gardner, tack differently in regard the Alabama Immigration Bill. And the Jenkins and McBride collection on Bonhoeffer and King would suggest dissent to Weaver here and the Political sideline Baps if I understand BDW's sentiment in the post above.
I understand the case for resignation. And all the hypocrisy and nihilism across spectrums.
Even so I found my recent spot reading of Dochuk's From Bible Belt to Sunbelt most interesting; and I hope with the new bent toward resignation there is not a whitewash of Baptist history, especially the 70's where it seems Pressler and James Dunn locked horns in Texas; and to paraphrase a recent Jerry Vines blog, the Rest is History.

I do wish BDW would do us the service of giving a link to the Brent Walker Response to the Young CBFfer.

[Stephen Fox]

[Big Daddy Weaver]

Hold on, don't lump me with Gardner or any politically disengaged person or theology.

I'm sure there's little difference between my view of political engagement and that of Parham and Walker. I'm in agreement with James Dunn's view as documented in my book endorsed by Bill Moyers/Melissa Rogers/Ed Gaustad/Sen. Jean Carnahan/Rep. Martin Frost/Buddy Shurden/Bill Leonard/Brent Walker and my good friend Angela Yarber

Here's the article on the from 2009 and here's (page 4)

[Big Daddy Weaver]

For your edification Foxy, I added a line in my original comment to clarify that I disagree with both my fellow younger Baptists - Russo and Gardner.

Come on Foxy, you should know I'm all for political engagement. I'd like to think my working on campaigns at UGA, working for John Lewis and off-and-on campaigning for Democratic candidates since then wasn't all for nothing.

Then again, I'm a little embarrassed to have spent a weekend in South Carolina, campaigning for the disgraced Senator from North Carolina leading up to the 2004 presidential primary.

[Sandy]

While Richard Land and many SBC leaders leave the impression that Southern Baptists are largely conservative Republicans, and that the denomination's "16 million members" generally support GOP causes, and that may very well be causing obstacles to evangelism, by observation, I don't think that's necessarily so. I wouldn't disagree that in the typical Southern Baptist church, the proverbial congregation with 120 people in attendance, median age 55, lily white, that a majority of those who are openly politically active would side with the GOP and its candidates, though I don't think it would necessarily be a large majority. And among the minority there are still plenty of Baptists who think that the church's primary mission is evangelism, not politics.

The SBC is working very hard to include African Americans, because their churches represent one of the segments of the SBC that is growing rapidly and where a lot of the baptisms can be found these days. Sometimes, I wonder if the motivation to help African American churches isn't, at least in part, to try to convert them politically. I have several African American friends who are quite high up the ladder in SBC life, and if that's been the expectation, then the effort isn't working very well. Likewise, the political rhetoric is missing in SBC Hispanic churches, which are also keeping the baptistry waters stirring and the church membership rolls growing. There are probably more politically conservative Hispanics than African Americans, though they are not anywhere close to a plurality, much less a majority.

Prior to the 80's, the political perspective of most Southern Baptist was simple silence, and for many, non-participation altogether. That still seems to be part of the fabric, regardless of the political rhetoric of the day.

[Jim]

[Sandy]

In the SBC, at the present time, it doesn't appear that there is an attempt to integrate African Americans into white churches, but mainly to provide resources to African Americans to assist them in church planting, with the idea that it may be more effective to do that than to try to plant African American churches with white church planters from somewhere down south. The result has been that ethnic church growth, particularly among African Americans and Hispanics, has exploded in the SBC.

Though I haven't heard it mentioned directly from anyone in leadership, I have heard the thought that SBC affiliation, and denominational relations, could be used to bring African Americans to a more conservative position politically from some who would be considered "grass roots Southern Baptists." Call that cynical if you want to, we are talking about individuals in a denomination whose Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission head has compromised just about every theological principle of the conservative resurgence to vocally, if not officially, support a Mormon running for President over like minded evangelical Christians. That takes the cynical out of it, don't you think?

[Jim]

[Ed Pettibone]

[Jim]