Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

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Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Rvaughn » Tue May 21, 2019 10:25 am

James Dew has been nominated as the next president of New Orleans Baptist Theological Seminary
James K. “Jamie” Dew Jr., vice president for undergraduate studies and distance learning at Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary...

Dew was elected to serve on the SEBTS faculty in 2011. Since 2013 he has directed the work of the College at Southeastern and served as a member of the SEBTS president’s cabinet. From 2013 until 2014, Dew served as dean of the College at Southeastern. In 2014, Dew’s role expanded when he was named vice president for undergraduate studies and distance learning. As vice president, Dew supervises the college, all aspects of distance learning, the prison programs, and the writing center.

Dew also teaches and mentors undergraduate, master’s, and doctoral students in his role as associate professor of philosophy and the history of ideas at SEBTS.

Dew’s academic preparation and credentials impressed the committee. After earning undergraduate degrees from Louisburg College in Louisburg, N.C., and Toccoa Falls College in Toccoa, Ga., Dew earned a master of divinity degree in pastoral ministry and a doctor of philosophy degree in theological studies from SEBTS. In July, Dew will graduate with a second doctor of philosophy degree from the University of Birmingham in Birmingham, UK. His second Ph.D. focuses on the philosophy of the mind and philosophy of religion.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Sandy » Tue May 21, 2019 12:30 pm

I don't know much about Dr. Dew. There shouldn't be any questions about his qualifications. Southeastern is a reasonable background for someone moving to another SBC seminary. The search committee for this position has made much about the inclusion of a man of color among the finalists. I'm not sure the reaction to that will be "well at least that was something" or the deepening of the disappointment that is accompanying yet another white guy getting an exec post in the SBC. I have to say, this is how most things turn out in the Southern Baptist Convention. They are a denomination good at visionary, prophetic language and short on vision and prophetic action. This particular individual seems less connected to the prominent insider elites in that he's not on as many committees and boards at the state or SBC level as most of the other picks have been.

I don't expect the SBC to ever open up executive leadership posts to members of ethnic or racial minorities. Ever.

This statement from Frank Cox, the chair of the search committee, was especially noteworthy:

Frank Cox, NOBTS Search Committee Chairman wrote:“When we sat down with him the first time, we had a God moment as a committee,” Cox said. “We realized that God had His hand on Dr. Dew. Every time we met with him, we became more convinced that he was God’s man for NOBTS.”


A "God moment" in addition to "God's hand" and "God's man" is certainly making a point.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Haruo » Tue May 21, 2019 12:32 pm

Gotta look up the University of Birmingham. Do we know if that's a residential doctorate or pure distance learning?
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby JE Pettibone » Tue May 21, 2019 8:58 pm

Ed: Toccoa Falls College in Toccoa, Ga., gives me serious pause, however one of the better pastors that I worked with while serving on the NYS Board of Missions is a graduate of Liberty, which gave me pause when I first met him.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby JE Pettibone » Tue May 21, 2019 9:14 pm

Haruo wrote:Gotta look up the University of Birmingham. Do we know if that's a residential doctorate or pure distance learning?

University of Birmingham


Ed: Here you go

Public University
The University of Birmingham is a public research university located in Edgbaston, Birmingham, United Kingdom. It received its royal charter in 1900 as a successor to Queen's College, Birmingham and Ma…
Tuition: £9,000 GBP (2016)
Motto: Per Ardua Ad Alta
Founded: 1900
Founder: Joseph Chamberlain
Address: Edgbaston, Birmingham, West Midlands B15 2TT
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Tim Bonney » Tue May 21, 2019 10:41 pm

Sandy wrote:A "God moment" in addition to "God's hand" and "God's man" is certainly making a point.


Good thing God constrained God’s self from putting God’s own hand on a woman. ;-)
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby William Thornton » Wed May 22, 2019 4:29 am

The worn out, silly code talk of search committees, "God's man, etc., is just a cliche. God may have little involvement in the choice. Every single failed SBC leader was "God's man" leading one to the obvious conclusion that God may be omnipotent but he is manifestly inept at choosing leaders.

The terminology is a way to signal the peons that the choice is not to be criticized, lest one criticize the Almighty himself.

The NOBTS choice is very qualified. It's a challenging situation. We have too many seminaries competing for students and that at a time of flat revenues and church growth.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Rvaughn » Wed May 22, 2019 10:37 am

Sandy wrote:The search committee for this position has made much about the inclusion of a man of color among the finalists. I'm not sure the reaction to that will be "well at least that was something" or the deepening of the disappointment that is accompanying yet another white guy getting an exec post in the SBC.
I noticed that too, that NOBTS found it very important to emphasize they had considered minority candidates. I suspect it will not lessen the criticism of not hiring a minority candidate.
Sandy wrote:A "God moment" in addition to "God's hand" and "God's man" is certainly making a point.

William Thornton wrote:The worn out, silly code talk of search committees, "God's man, etc., is just a cliche...The terminology is a way to signal the peons that the choice is not to be criticized, lest one criticize the Almighty himself.
I used to not think much about such statements, but I think you are right that this is a sort of "code word."
Last edited by Rvaughn on Wed May 22, 2019 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Sandy » Wed May 22, 2019 10:43 am

JE Pettibone wrote:Ed: Toccoa Falls College in Toccoa, Ga., gives me serious pause, however one of the better pastors that I worked with while serving on the NYS Board of Missions is a graduate of Liberty, which gave me pause when I first met him.


Toccoa Falls College? Why would that give you pause, a personal experience? It's small, so there are limits on offerings but its a good school and probably has more alumni on the international mission field per capita than most schools.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Rvaughn » Wed May 22, 2019 10:43 am

JE Pettibone wrote:Ed: Toccoa Falls College in Toccoa, Ga., gives me serious pause...
Any particular concerns, Ed? That it is small? Not affiliated with Baptists? Not up to par?

We have to been Toccoa Falls (the waterfall, which is actually on the campus), but I have no knowledge of the school. I looked it up online. Apparently it is affiliated with the Christian and Missionary Alliance.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Sandy » Wed May 22, 2019 11:01 am

Rvaughn wrote:I used to not think much of such statements, but I think you are right that this is a sort of "code word."


In SBC speak, most definitely. It's a signal to the whole trustee board that the vote needs to be unanimous because those with enough influence and the connections to be put on the search committee have spoken and they want this to look good because he's their guy. And as William said, a signal to the peons that those with the influence and ability to call the shots have done so.

The two seminary choices actually appear to be based almost completely on their credentials and experience. On the surface it does not seem that there's a connection between Dr. Dew and Dr. Kelley but the latter has his own web of influence to get what he wants done and I wouldn't be surprised to find Dr. Dew's name on a short list in Kelley's desk.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby JE Pettibone » Wed May 22, 2019 1:46 pm

Rvaughn wrote:
JE Pettibone wrote:Ed: Toccoa Falls College in Toccoa, Ga., gives me serious pause...
Any particular concerns, Ed? That it is small? Not affiliated with Baptists? Not up to par?

We have to been Toccoa Falls (the waterfall, which is actually on the campus), but I have no knowledge of the school. I looked it up online. Apparently it is affiliated with the Christian and Missionary Alliance.



Ed: Robert why when I make a statement do you in invariably offer a guess at the reasoning behind it? I would have to go back and check but it seems that at best you have batted around 100. My pause goes back to the previous century when I was green Ministerial student and many of fellow students who where ultra conservative, at Howard (now Samford), talked about the Bible Conferences and subsequent revivals at Toccoa as if they where the gateway to heaven. Pause here was intended as a yellow flag, neither black or red.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Sandy » Wed May 22, 2019 2:32 pm

JE Pettibone wrote:My pause goes back to the previous century when I was green Ministerial student and many of fellow students who where ultra conservative, at Howard (now Samford), talked about the Bible Conferences and subsequent revivals at Toccoa as if they where the gateway to heaven. Pause here was intended as a yellow flag, neither black or red.


Ultra conservatives are as much in need of revival as moderates or liberals from my perspective.

I knew very little about Toccoa Falls until joining the Christian and Missionary Alliance in 2010 and being a member of a church with half a dozen members who graduated from there, along with the pastor. I guess perspective leads to the use of the term "ultra" in front of conservative. It's conservative as far as colleges go, distinctively Christian though it has expanded beyond just being a Bible college into liberal arts in the past couple of decades. It's not as conservative nor anywhere near fundamentalist as Liberty, might be a little more than Samford, is accredited and has a staff with excellent credentials.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby JE Pettibone » Wed May 22, 2019 3:07 pm

Sandy writes "Ultra conservatives are as much in need of revival as moderates or liberals from my perspective."

Ed: Perhaps more so. tic BTW, in my observation of SBC Seminaries over the past 64 years New Orleans has consistently been the most conservative of the 6.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Rvaughn » Wed May 22, 2019 3:34 pm

JE Pettibone wrote:Ed: Robert, why when I make a statement do you in invariably offer a guess at the reasoning behind it? I would have to go back and check but it seems that at best you have batted around 100.
I suppose it is part of my way of thinking and learning. When I offer those guesses it reflects things I thought/wondered about. Do you find it annoying or something? If so, I'll try to remember that. I'm not trying to set any batting record.
JE Pettibone wrote:My pause goes back to the previous century when I was green Ministerial student and many of fellow students who where ultra conservative, at Howard (now Samford), talked about the Bible Conferences and subsequent revivals at Toccoa as if they where the gateway to heaven.
Thanks. I find that interesting.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Tim Bonney » Wed May 22, 2019 5:15 pm

William Thornton wrote:The terminology is a way to signal the peons that the choice is not to be criticized, lest one criticize the Almighty himself.

The NOBTS choice is very qualified. It's a challenging situation. We have too many seminaries competing for students and that at a time of flat revenues and church growth.


I have no reference to doubt his qualifications. But, like you, I noticed the "code words" for "don't disagree with us.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby JE Pettibone » Thu May 23, 2019 10:51 am

Rvaughn wrote:
JE Pettibone wrote:Ed: Robert, why when I make a statement do you in invariably offer a guess at the reasoning behind it? I would have to go back and check but it seems that at best you have batted around 100.
I suppose it is part of my way of thinking and learning. When I offer those guesses it reflects things I thought/wondered about. Do you find it annoying or something? If so, I'll try to remember that. I'm not trying to set any batting record.
JE Pettibone wrote:My pause goes back to the previous century when I was green Ministerial student and many of fellow students who where ultra conservative, at Howard (now Samford), talked about the Bible Conferences and subsequent revivals at Toccoa as if they where the gateway to heaven.
Thanks. I find that interesting.


Ed: Thanks for the reply Robert. Sometimes we react to things in the distant past that may be best forgotten. Yet the ""those who ignore history are .... to ...... it."
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Sandy » Mon May 27, 2019 10:44 pm

JEPettibone wrote: My pause goes back to the previous century when I was green Ministerial student and many of fellow students who where ultra conservative, at Howard (now Samford), talked about the Bible Conferences and subsequent revivals at Toccoa as if they where the gateway to heaven. Pause here was intended as a yellow flag, neither black or red.


I believe in spontaneous movements of the Holy Spirit on people in Bible conferences or revival meetings resulting in conviction of sin and repentance that produces a visible, emotional reaction in the people who are present. I don't necessarily see that those kinds of things are limited to the "ultra-conservative." I don't know the history of those kinds of things at Toccoa Falls College, but I wouldn't say they are the exclusive domain of conservatives. I would hope that all Baptists at least would be open to the movement of the Holy Spirit especially when he has been invited to be present in a gathering of Christians.

My own experience at Southwestern would lead me to say that perhaps New Orleans was historically one of the more conservative of the SBC's six seminaries but when it comes down to it, in reality, Southwestern was equally so, as was Golden Gate. The conservative resurgence focused its attention mainly on Southeastern and Southern, where there were some notable differences of opinion. Midwestern was struggling to stay open at the time.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby JE Pettibone » Tue May 28, 2019 8:29 am

Ed: As you write "I believe in spontaneous movements of the Holy Spirit on people in Bible conferences or revival meetings resulting in conviction of sin and repentance that produces a visible, emotional reaction in the people who are present. I don't necessarily see that those kinds of things are limited to the "ultra-conservative." I don't know the history of those kinds of things at Toccoa Falls College, but I wouldn't say they are the exclusive domain of conservatives. I would hope that all Baptists at least would be open to the movement of the Holy Spirit especially when he has been invited to be present in a gathering of Christians". We Agree.

And Sandy just when was it that you where at Southwestern?
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Sandy » Tue May 28, 2019 8:45 am

I enrolled in Southwestern in the fall of 1987, during the presidency of Dr. Russell Dilday. Trying to make a comparison of how conservative an SBC seminary was in the decades prior to the conservative resurgence is going to be based on the opinions and conversations of those who attended them at the time. When I was in college in the late 70's, the professors in the Bible department where I went to school were pretty unanimous in their evaluation that Southwestern was the most conservative of the six. Of the four professors in the department, one had both masters and doctorate from Southwestern, and two of the others had a masters from Southern with a doctorate from Southwestern. The other one had degrees from Moody and from Regents Park College at Oxford. There was no encouragement from them for ministerial students to go to Southern, and while Golden Gate was the top choice for students at the college I attended, the profs promoted Southwestern as the more conservative of the two. New Orleans was never mentioned, as far as I can remember and I don't know anyone from college who went there.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby Haruo » Tue May 28, 2019 8:08 pm

Remind me to ask the Holy Spirit about their preferred pronouns. ;-) Feminine in Hebrew, Neuter in Greek, Masculine in Latin.
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End of the "effort" to have at least one Minority Exec

Postby Sandy » Sat Jun 01, 2019 1:51 pm

So this selection at New Orleans more or less eliminates the possibility of an exec of one of the SBC entities being someone from one of the well-represented minority groups within the convention. There are some disappointed bloggers, a few, not many. Otherwise, other than a few isolated spots on the internet, most Southern Baptists are more than likely not aware of who the individuals are or where the vacancies were located.

I saw a few comments about such selections being made based on the merits of the individuals hired, regardless of their racial background. You should always want the best man (or woman) for the job, right? But I doubt that's possible in the SBC. Leaders in the SBC are selected based on the number of influential friends they have on whatever trustee board or search committee is operating at the time. All of those individuals that have been selected this time around have rotated from multiple boards and committees and are denominational insiders with the exception of Dr. Dew. Most individuals associated with the growing minority churches in the SBC don't have time for the meetings and tea parties it takes to be appointed to a committee or a board. It will be a while longer before there is change in this regard.

It's hard for me to see how they can argue that women can't serve in denominational leadership and claim that has anything to do with Biblical instruction. Denominations aren't churches and are not mentioned in the Bible. There are no Biblical qualifications from a Biblical perspective for denominational committee or board service.
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Re: Dew nominated to lead New Orleans Seminary

Postby JE Pettibone » Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:40 pm

Ed: Sandy, I would guess those making the decision on filling the top post in SBC entities would justify ignoring females as prospects because ones filling those positions need more significant local church experience than their understanding of Baptist Polity permits. I further suspect this a major factor in their refusal to permit female pastors.

I wish Dr. Drew and all at New Orleans Baptist Seminary well because two of my favorite CBFers and one of my favorite pastors in my SBC days where alumni. There may be more among my Baptist friends but those three the are the first off the top of my head.

I am not sure it would be fair to blame the institution for Patterson.
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