Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Discuss current news and trends taking place in the Southern Baptist Convention.

Moderator: William Thornton

Re: What are Sandy's examples of responding in kind?

Postby TrudyU » Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:12 am

Stephen Fox wrote:I'm not saying they didn't exist, but taken in context it could be interesting to review a few


Ed: And Sandy unless and until you take up Foxes challenge I will continue to reject your revisionist insinuations about the
moderate players responses to the takeover of the SBC.

And when you write "Moore's theology reflected that of the people in the pews who make up the SBC and all of its various parts, a fact that has been confirmed a thousand times, on every level of convention organization from the local church to the national convention." I will first ask whom have you read in this discussion saying any thing about Moore's "Theology", and then ask what do you know about his Theology.

And when you say "The SBC is well beyond the point of acknowledging, or responding to, the criticism of the few remaining moderates", I must ask, so why then did Moore offer at this late date, what you and others call an apology.

And when you refer to the "few remaining moderates" I am persuaded that there are more than a "few" remaining moderates in churches sill affiliated with the SBC, perhaps fewer each year. But at the recent CBF Assembly in Greensboro I met at least a half dozen folk from at least three states for whom this was their first Assembly, who said something to the effect of "I wish some of the folk from my SBC church where here to see and feel this." A few added,"but then, I didn't tell them I was coming, they will know I was here, even if I have to start looking for a new church".
Last edited by TrudyU on Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
TrudyU
 
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:11 pm

Re: What are Sandy's examples of responding in kind?

Postby Tom Parker » Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:16 am

TrudyU wrote:
Stephen Fox wrote:I'm not saying they didn't exist, but taken in context it could be interesting to review a few


Ed: And Sandy unless and until you take up Foxes challenge I will continue to reject your revisionist insinuations about the
moderate players responses to the takeover of the SBC.

And when you write "Moore's theology reflected that of the people in the pews who make up the SBC and all of its various parts, a fact that has been confirmed a thousand times, on every level of convention organization from the local church to the national convention." I will first ask whom have you read in this discussion saying any thing about Moore's "Theology" and then ask what do you know about his Theology. And when you say "The SBC is well beyond the point of acknowledging, or responding to, the criticism of the few remaining moderates", I must ask so why then did Moore offer at this late date what you and others call an apology. And when you refer to the "few remaining moderates" I am persuaded that there are more than a "few" remaining moderates in churches sill affiliated with the SBC, perhaps fewer each year. But at the recent CBF Assembly in Greensboro I met at least a half dozen folk from at least three states for whom this was their first Assembly who said I wish some of the folk from my SBC church where here to see and feel this. A few added, "but then, I didn't tell them I was coming, they will know I was here even if I have to start looking for a new church".



Ed, I'm betting Sandy will not be up for Stephen's challenge. I believe if the truth was known there are many "moderates" siting in SBC churches this morning. For whatever reasons they have not left the SBC yet.

The SBC has more problems than they can ever imagine.
Tom Parker
 
Posts: 255
Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:34 pm

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby TrudyU » Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:55 am

Tom Parker replied to my post " Ed, I'm betting Sandy will not be up for Stephen's challenge. I believe if the truth was known there are many "moderates" siting in SBC churches this morning. For whatever reasons they have not left the SBC yet.

The SBC has more problems than they can ever imagine."

Ed: Tom, I will quite surprised if Sandy, take up that challenge but also disappointed. I would like to see us have some real discussion rather than what has to often been in my opinion, ill founded slap-downs.

And when you say "The SBC has more problems than they can ever imagine." I am not so sure, they have pretty good imaginations. :wink:

I wish I could be in a Sunday School class of a SBC church this morning if and when Moore's purported apology comes up.

But alas I am not even in our own SS as the time stamp may show. Maybe I spent too much time in the heat the last couple days. Today, I an staying in and resting up for the surgery on my hand scheduled for Wednesday. I hope they moved our worship service to the Fellowship hall which has AC.
TrudyU
 
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:11 pm

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby Timothy Bonney » Sun Jul 21, 2013 10:03 am

Ed I bet most SS classes in SBC churches will hear nothing about the apology. I think that is one of the reasons the takeover worked. The average SBC church never seemed to be that involved in national denominational politics other than the few who attended as Messengers. The smaller churches I had connection with often only the pastor and maybe the pastor's spouse attended. So whatever the pastor reported was all you got.

I'm not avoiding them per se but I've not been in a Baptist church in over three years, SS or otherwise. When you work elsewhere on Sundays you don't get many days to visit other churches. When I do I usually go to the TEC down the street because I know I'll get communion no matter what Sunday I visit on. :)
Tim Bonney
Senior Pastor
Grace United Methodist Church
Sioux City, Iowa
Blog - http://circuitwriter.org
User avatar
Timothy Bonney
Site Admin
 
Posts: 3690
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:17 am
Location: Sioux City, Iowa

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby TrudyU » Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:52 pm

Timothy Bonney wrote:Ed I bet most SS classes in SBC churches will hear nothing about the apology. I think that is one of the reasons the takeover worked. The average SBC church never seemed to be that involved in national denominational politics other than the few who attended as Messengers. The smaller churches I had connection with often only the pastor and maybe the pastor's spouse attended. So whatever the pastor reported was all you got.

I'm not avoiding them per se but I've not been in a Baptist church in over three years, SS or otherwise. When you work elsewhere on Sundays you don't get many days to visit other churches. When I do I usually go to the TEC down the street because I know I'll get communion no matter what Sunday I visit on. :)


Ed: Tim. I don't bet, Wouldn't even be tempted by such a sucker bet. Look again at what I said, "I wish I could be in a Sunday School class of a SBC church this morning if and when Moore's purported apology comes up "note the If & when"
With apologies to our friends Thornton and Flick, If I where traveling in the bible belt to have a chance of such a discussion I would avoid churches where pickup trucks were the majority of vehicles in the parking lot. And Tim during my 30 years as a lay person in the SBC I only attended three SBC conventions and one of those (1990) was after I had retired the first time, and started back to seminary. During that time most of the Churches where I held membership sent their pastor and perhaps his wife and generally one or two other couples. Those churches ranged from 40 to4000 members, most between 150 & 300. Some but not all put on a push to enlist their full compliment of messengers. But during the same time I had relatives through my first wife, who where members of small rural churches served by pastors who where ministerial students at Convention related Colleges. These Student pastors where keenly aware of and concerned about the politics of the Convention and provided their congregations with detailed reports. And there where many discussions about the stories in their State Baptist papers.
TrudyU
 
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:11 pm

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby Timothy Bonney » Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:57 pm

Good points Ed. And as you say, student pastors are well aware of what is going on the denomination.
Tim Bonney
Senior Pastor
Grace United Methodist Church
Sioux City, Iowa
Blog - http://circuitwriter.org
User avatar
Timothy Bonney
Site Admin
 
Posts: 3690
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:17 am
Location: Sioux City, Iowa

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby Tom Parker » Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:55 am

Sandy:

You have had several days to come up with examples and I do not see where you have even posted one.
Tom Parker
 
Posts: 255
Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:34 pm

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby David Flick » Thu Jul 25, 2013 1:21 am

TrudyU wrote:
Timothy Bonney wrote:Ed I bet most SS classes in SBC churches will hear nothing about the apology. I think that is one of the reasons the takeover worked. The average SBC church never seemed to be that involved in national denominational politics other than the few who attended as Messengers. The smaller churches I had connection with often only the pastor and maybe the pastor's spouse attended. So whatever the pastor reported was all you got.

I'm not avoiding them per se but I've not been in a Baptist church in over three years, SS or otherwise. When you work elsewhere on Sundays you don't get many days to visit other churches. When I do I usually go to the TEC down the street because I know I'll get communion no matter what Sunday I visit on. :)


Ed: Tim. I don't bet, Wouldn't even be tempted by such a sucker bet. Look again at what I said, "I wish I could be in a Sunday School class of a SBC church this morning if and when Moore's purported apology comes up "note the If & when"
With apologies to our friends Thornton and Flick, If I where traveling in the bible belt to have a chance of such a discussion I would avoid churches where pickup trucks were the majority of vehicles in the parking lot. And Tim during my 30 years as a lay person in the SBC I only attended three SBC conventions and one of those (1990) was after I had retired the first time, and started back to seminary. During that time most of the Churches where I held membership sent their pastor and perhaps his wife and generally one or two other couples. Those churches ranged from 40 to4000 members, most between 150 & 300. Some but not all put on a push to enlist their full compliment of messengers. But during the same time I had relatives through my first wife, who where members of small rural churches served by pastors who where ministerial students at Convention related Colleges. These Student pastors where keenly aware of and concerned about the politics of the Convention and provided their congregations with detailed reports. And there where many discussions about the stories in their State Baptist papers.

I don't know if William has a pickup truck or not (don't think he does), but the notion that you can judge the political or theological leanings of any Baptist or group of Baptists by a vehicle is borderline preposterous. I can assure you that the fact that I do own one has nothing whatsoever to do with anything denominational or political. Just as you can't judge a book by the cover, you can't judge a person by the vehicle s/he drives...
User avatar
David Flick
Site Admin
 
Posts: 7985
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:55 pm
Location: Oklahoma City, OK

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby William Thornton » Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:02 am

I have driven old, beatup pickups for years. David drives luxury trucks. Mine would even shame a redneck.
My stray thoughts on SBC stuff may be found at my blog, SBC Plodder
User avatar
William Thornton
Site Admin
 
Posts: 10527
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 10:30 pm
Location: Atlanta

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby Sandy » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:27 am

Tom Parker wrote:Sandy:

You have had several days to come up with examples and I do not see where you have even posted one.


Tom,
Stephen wanted examples of "responding in kind." I can certainly cite the general responses of individuals like Robert Parham, and the staff at ABP, and people like Randall Lolley or Roy Honeycutt. Specific examples of responses to Moore, and other SBC writers of that period of time, have to be searched, and that takes time. If you want a more immediate response, here is a link to ABP archives. You might find something I referenced, and you'll enjoy the nostalgic trip through the time when moderates were putting their feet in their mouth, and when Southern Baptists were getting their convention and its institutions back from the liberals.

When I find examples of "in kind" responses, I will be glad to post the links or scans here.

http://www.abpnews.com/archives
Sandy
Sandy
 
Posts: 6334
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 5:10 pm
Location: Rural Western Pennsylvania

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby TrudyU » Sun Jul 28, 2013 12:17 am

William Thornton wrote:I have driven old, beatup pickups for years. David drives luxury trucks. Mine would even shame a redneck.


Ed: Indeed William, Flick, has provided transportation for Trudy and I a couple times at various National CBF and Mainstream meetings, in a very fine Ford Pick Up. But the little green Chevy Pick Up that you where driving when we followed you across Bham's Red Mountain on the way to "Eggsactly" didn't really look beat up.

Since I offered an apology to the two of you ahead of my comment, I was a bit surprised at David's getting bent out of shape about it. I do however believe, there is generally a correlation between the types of vehicles in a church parking lot, and both their theology and polity. In my much moving, it served me well in the selection of places to worship. In the same way I avoid churches where most staff have I Pads. :wink:
TrudyU
 
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:11 pm

Re: Russ Moore feels bad about his CBF reporting

Postby William Thornton » Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:11 am

TrudyU wrote:But the little green Chevy Pick Up that you where driving when we followed you across Bham's Red Mountain on the way to "Eggsactly" didn't really look beat up.


The green GMC is two old trucks ago. It was a good truck.

...ipads...


Father's Day 2012 my kids and wife gave me a full size ipad. I never would have spent the $$ on it myself but it is a dream.
My stray thoughts on SBC stuff may be found at my blog, SBC Plodder
User avatar
William Thornton
Site Admin
 
Posts: 10527
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 10:30 pm
Location: Atlanta

Dallas Willard

Postby Stephen Fox » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:14 am

William. Preacher I heard yesterday had a good closing. Said Dallas Willard's Mother dies when he was two, and his father later told him her dying words were: "Make sure the children never lose sight of eternity!"
"I'm the only sane {person} in here." Doyle Hargraves, Slingblade
"Midget, Broom; Helluva campaign". Political consultant, "Oh, Brother..."


http://www.foxofbama.blogspot.com or google asfoxseesit
Stephen Fox
 
Posts: 7959
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:29 pm

Previous

Return to SBC News and Trends

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest