Job Opening of Interest to more Conservative Ministers

[bobfrgsn]

[William Thornton]

[Joshua Villines]

[KeithE]

[TimW]

[bobfrgsn]

[John Sneed]

[Joshua Villines]

I'm surprised to hear you resistant to the term subordinate (but that may be my military background). Humans are pack animals, and someone has to be in charge.

I believe a church should call their Pastor; but I don't think that a search committee is necessary for other staff positions. The Pastor is the one responsible for implementing the congregation's vision for the church. As part of that, the pastor provides the guidance and leadership necessary for their subordinates to coordinate their particular area of expertise with that vision.

Although I don't generally like corporate models for church work, in this area secular businesses have the right idea.

No Board of Directors would tell their CEO whom she should hire as one of her VP's. If the Board doesn't trust their CEO to choose good people and fulfill the Board's vision for the company, the Board will simply fire the CEO.

In addition, congregants, like board members, are generally only present when staff members are fulfilling 10 or 20 percent of their duties. Not to mention, most of them are not trained in the staff member's field, and therefore can only provide general feedback on the staff member's performance.

-Joshua

As a side note, I've never liked the term "Senior Pastor". A church has one Pastor. In addition, it may have any number of subordinate staff members who assist the Pastor with his or her duties. Those duties remain the Pastor's, however, their fulfillment has simply been delegated to another competent clergyperson.

[Joshua Villines]

[Joshua Villines]

[Sandy]

I'll avoid commenting on the position offered at the Scotsdale Baptist Church, since the pastor was banned from the board, but want to add to the thread drift.

Having only been an interim pastor, I can't speak from that perspective. I've been youth pastor, Minister of Education, Worship leader (music and choir), church administrator and other duties as assigned. From that perspective, I can say that I wouldn't accept a position where either the pastor had authority to hire and fire, or where a personnel committee had that authority. The authority needs to be congregational, but there should be a level of accountability given to both the pastor and a personnel committee, or better yet, a "ministry personnel team."

I've never seen any church staff position I've held as being "subordinate" to that of the pastor, though I do clearly understand how he is held accountable for everything, whether that's right or not. As a result, even though I see my own calling as equal to his, I also see it as supportive of his. I'd never accept a position unless the pastor were the first church member to approve, and before I would consent to being called (NOT HIRED!) I'd want to spend a lot of time with him before hand. I'd need to be able to support him with conviction. I'd want the same level of support from him.

I'd also want some kind of vote from the congregation, whether it was an actual vote to extend a call, or an affirmation of the pastor's decision. Decisions related to church ministries from that point on should be mutually inclusive and informative. I'd certainly not move forward on my own without keeping the pastor informed and having his approval, likewise, the church leadership and other staff. And I'd expect to be kept informed of things going on in other areas of the church ministry, whether they were in my field of expertise or not.

I've seen too many situations where conflict between the staff, or between a staff member and a committee, or a staff member and a pastor caused difficulty in a church. I think that's the result of too few people having too much power, and as Christians, there is a balance that can be achieved.

[Ed Pettibone]

[William Thornton]

[TimW]

[Joshua Villines]

To quote Opus from Bloom County, "To each their own Dentifris!"

I have no desire to be on a ministry "team". I'd much rather be on the staff, be it as an Associate Pastor who is subordinate to a Pastor or as the Pastor.

I've seen too many churches turn into welfare programs for the professionally incompetent because everyone is so busy feeling "empowered" that no one is actually working. In those circumstances, the Pastor needs the kind of authority that comes from being able to see "You're not doing your job, so it's no longer your job and I'm going to find someone who can do it."

-Joshua

[Norm]

[Sandy]

[Jonathan]

[rickwright01]

[Mark]

[Mark]

[rickwright01]

[Mark]

[rickwright01]