Paid holidays

[Chris]

It came to my attention today, that the office staff (and interim pastor) at our church was given Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday off (with pay), Thanksgiving week, Christmas week, and New Year week. So...what difference does it make? It happens that a church member was taken to hospital Tuesday night Dec. 22nd. It is believed that a family member called the church office and left a voice mail. Since the secretary was given the day off Wednesday, she would not have gotten the message until Dec. 28. The lady lay in hospital for 5 days wondering why no one came to visit her. (And she is disappointed).
I am wondering if we have reached a time in small and medium-size churches where three days off with pay is the norm for Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Year.
I think this is too lenient. I know of no commercial business, or non-profit, that does this.
Do any of your churches have this policy?

[Neil Heath]

The calendar heavily influences the days off each year. In 2016 Christmas is on Sunday. Bet a lot of church staff have to work that day, and Sat. too for Christmas Eve services. How many weekdays should they get off in that case?

This year our church office was staffed until noon Wed. of each week, I believe. Our members are always encouraged to contact ministers directly if they know of a need, and that contact is as likely to be a text as to be a phone call. Our staff works almost exclusively with cell phones now, so a message left on the office answering machine might be missed for a while. I'm not sure if the thing still works.

Since most churches make their members aware of any days when the office will be closed, I think in your example they should have called a staff member instead of the office, to make sure someone got word of the need.

[Chris]

[Tim Bonney]

Chris,

Our office was closed Thanksgiving Day and Friday. We were closed Christmas Eve afternoon (our secretary is part-time) as well as Christmas Day and then the following Monday as our staff gets two days for Christmas. As said above, what days we are closed around holidays depends a lot on what day Christmas falls on. If Christmas falls on a Sunday then the office will likely be closed either on Friday or Monday as Christmas is a paid holiday for staff but we do have church on the 25th if it is on a Sunday. (As it will be next year) plus an additional day on one end or the other to make the two days.

The solution that has worked best for us is that our answering system will forward messages. If you leave a message on my voicemail at church my cell phone gets a call telling me I have voice mail I then enter my password and get the message. After all, what do people do after hours on any day? Some emergencies shouldn't wait until the next day.

We also are very careful to publish what days and times the office is open and closed for holidays. Also my phone number is in the pictorial directory. If you have an interim possibly his/her phone number should be put in the church bulletin so that people can call them when the office is closed.

[Tim Bonney]

Oh, just for clarity, what days the pastor has off may be different from what days her/his staff have off. Interim positions are negotiated separately usually from long term staff members when the interim takes the position.

My church has a personal handbook with items such as vacation time and days off. We are going to be doing more this year to clarify how vacation accrues.

In my situation the Annual Conference determines my days off and vacation time during the year and I coordinate that with the church leadership and church staff. (I know this doesn't apply directly Baptists but it isn't unusual for the pastor to have a different arrangement than staff from my past experience.)

[Ed Pettibone]

Ed: I certifiably empathize with the woman who was in the hospital and with her family. Every member of a church should have access to an active emergency contact with the church. If I get a call when Trudy is not here, I refer the caller to the Chair of Deacons or given the circumstance take the callers name and number and I call Trudy's cell phone.

If some one calls the Burnt Hills Baptist church when the office is not open and that is most of the time, They get a recorded message that includes the parsonage phone number for emergencies. Every active member also has a membership directory that list the number of all others. Yes, I know that would not float in some churches.

To my knowledge there is only one active member of our church who does not have a cell phone. And his daughter & son in law and grand children who are not members of our church do have our contact info. I do not know how many members have smart phones. I do have a smart phone but I do not text except between Trudy and I. I do have and use voice mail.

Every church needs to have an annual policy review and make any needed adjustments to any and all policies including leave time for Holidays sickness and vacation. See Tim's posts above

Chris' post brings up some questions that could make for interesting discussion. The thread title makes me wonder if the primary concern is the missed ministry obligation or "Paid holidays". And when I see a post that involves an Interim Pastor in something of a negative light. I always wonder is that individual was truly called as an interim Pastor or as an interim preacher and is that clear among the membership.

[Dave Roberts]

I have done three sequential interims. In each case, the church reimbursed part of my cell phone expense each month in order to publish my number. If the church wants this kind of access, it is normally negotiated in the interim minister's covenant with the church. I have never served a church where holidays were simply set by the staff or granted by the minister. Usually. there is a policy, either from the personnel committee or church to set those days. Most modern voicemail equipment can be easily accessed from offsite locations. Also, we have normally changed the message for the holiday and have given the emergency contact information for the person on call. I have always made certain that someone will check the voicemail during holiday periods. Check to see what is the policy, Chris, and how coverage is implemented for holiday periods. During holidays. it is important to have a system to cover what is being done.

[Chris]

Thanks David. Some good ideas. I will bring them up at next Deacon meeting.

[William Thornton]

Good question about paid holidays, Chris. I served as the only paid clergy staff for about half of my 30 years and with one other full time staff the other half. There was never a time when members didn't have my contact number. Officially, Christmas and Thanksgiving each included two paid days. It wasn't important to have a church office with regular daily hours.

The situation you describe sounds perfect for a deacon-on-call sort of arrangement.

In talking to laypeople, faithful church members, they almost always have concluded that their church staff will not be at the office on Fridays much, never on Saturdays. Clergy are the most creative group I know when it comes to finding extra time off.

[Tim Bonney]

I think both Dave and William make a good point about the importance of contact numbers for emergencies. This really isn't so much about when the office is open as the availability of pastoral staff for emergencies. There is always a good chance if someone leaves a message on a voice mail on Friday afternoon late it might not get heard until Sunday unless you have a policy in place for checking voice mail and/or regularly available emergency contacts.

I also thought Ed was right about asking the expectations of the interim. There is a big difference between "interim pastor" and a weekend interim pulpit supply. I've known cases where the expectation on the interim for hospital calls and emergencies was much different than the regular pastor because they might actually live out of town or only be at the church a reduced number of days.

Also, in defense of pastors and church staff, we really need to encourage families to expect that if they leave a message and don't hear from someone in a day or two they ought to call again. Things can always go wrong with answering machines and communication mistakes can happen. If you wait five days and no one responds there odds are pretty high that no one heard the message and not that no one cared to visit.

[Dave Roberts]

[Chris]

[Tim Bonney]

Chris,

This may constitute unwanted advice but I'd not deal with both these issues at once.

Your church can set whatever vacation time seems reasonable. But it seems to me that punishing the secretary for having taken vacation she was given may be a bad idea here. That is how it will look if you talk about reducing days off and the emergency call system at the same time. The fact that no system was set up for you to get a call when she is on vacation isn't her fault unless she was tasked with creating such a system. I would deal with both issues separately.

I would deal with the emergency contact issue now. Then down the road, when this cools off a little, I'd ask whoever constitutes your HR committee to deal with what is or isn't appropriate days off around Christmas. If the call had come on the 24th would you be saying that the secretary shouldn't get off Christmas Eve etc.? Because given your current setup the same thing would have happened on the 23rd, the 24th or even the 25th (5 days, 4 days or three days with no visit respectively.)

It is the system of emergency contact (or lack thereof) that is at fault and not a staff member getting a day off given her by the church. And the family's fault in part for waiting five days before trying something again.

(End potentially unwanted advice. )

[Chris]

Good advice, Timothy. Thanks. I'll take it.

[Tim Bonney]