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BaptistLife.Com Forums. • View topic - Imagine a Better America
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Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:46 pm
by KeithE
My travels the last few years have shown me how good life is in Sweden, Denmark, Norway and France. Most love their governments and are happy with their lives; I saw no poverty (but I’m sure it exists but at lower levels than the US - ). Israel was also prosperous but politically divided - not all Israelites approve of the settlements and bombardment/blockade of Gaza (this comes from articles I’ve read as I really did not talk with any Israelites except 2 people at an anti-war museum who were anti-Netanyahu). Now many workers on cruises (mainly from 3rd world countries) did not have good lives back home and I’m not advocating copying the Philippines or the other countries (Philippines seemed to be the most prevalent). I believe in capitalism (if it is controlled when it overly helps corporations, disservices people, or lets inequality grow to outlandish degrees). But the social democracy model of the Scandinavian countries seems right to me.

My travel across I-40 in last few weeks has shown me struggling Americans at truck stops, a casino and nurses. I had thought truckers made good pay - the ones I talked with are barely surviving (some living mainly in their trucks and wives who have left them because they had to be away from home). Some at the casinos were well off (e.g. a group from LaCross WI), some were getting by (e.g. the blackjack dealers, seniors) but many (perhaps most) appeared down and outers (although I did not talk with any of those). The nurses in the hospital (several of which got their training in Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria) worked three 12- hour days a week at the hospital at “slightly more than min wage” (one older lady said), and have to work the other days at other jobs to feed their families/pay rent. One very good and knowledgable single guy nurse (maybe 35 yrs old) is commuting to Phoenix to try to become a doctor and going into great debt to do so. My daughter's friends lived in poverty and have depression over their plight (btw, she said she dissuaded one from suiclde). These are not all bad people, just have little opportunity.

The contrast from the upbeat Scandinavians and the people I met along I-40 is stark.

Now I do not trust these ad hoc meet ups, but the I-40 trip broke my heart. I look to academic or official government sources of whole populations to fully inform my views.

Many of the Democratic candidates are proposing remedies (proven by European experience) and we should not let cries of “socialism” derail these ideas.

Seriously consider each idea to improve the lot of Americans (the 80+% of Americans whose life has been diminished due to conservative/GOP “trickle down” policies). We can be as successful and happy as say ; all have universal health care, much less inequality, elder care, childcare, paid family leave, free education (K-PHD) - they do not mind paying taxes up to 50% if they have these services. US is number 18, not bad but could be better.

There is plenty of money available for valuable social programs (health care, infrastructure/jobs, vocational education) from a portion of the excess corporate profits () that is not being used to reinvest or provide jobs.
- And/or a .
- And/or a .
- And/or a 70% tax on income over $1M/year raising revenues between depending the degree of tax avoidance achieved.

Now I do not think we can immediately switch to full Scandinavian “social democracy” given our national debt, but we can make strides.

Imagine a better US.

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 7:02 pm
by William Thornton
Glad you are feeling better and that you are up to a post like this.

I'll respond tomorrow but explain the nurse pay. RNs in Phoenix are over$30/hr. Aides?

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 7:56 pm
by KeithE

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 8:20 pm
by KeithE
Just to demonstrate further the difficulty of living on a nurses wage consider the average RN salary (a degreed position) and the living wage in Kingman AZ (where I was)

Average RN pay across the country is I would guess that rural Kingman would be less. You are right Phoenix average is

Whereas in Kingman.

There are a lot of hurting/accomplished people out there in America.

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 5:00 am
by William Thornton
Tough to get by on 50k per year? My how the thresholds have changed.

Sweden the socialist utopia? Might read this: https://reason.com/reasontv/2018/10/23/ ... st-success

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 9:51 am
by KeithE

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 11:37 am
by KeithE
Made some additions to the above. Please read in detail including the backup links and comment.

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 2:01 pm
by William Thornton
Unlearn and relearn. Whiff of reeducation camps?

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:36 pm
by Haruo

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:59 pm
by KeithE

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:46 pm
by Sandy

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 12:44 pm
by Haruo
Even the United States has by and large gone for socialized (or at any rate not profit-driven) fire fighting for generations now. Public schools and public libraries have faced more serious obstacles to maintaining their socialist credentials. Mrs. De Vos may finally undo the great damage caused over the years by those two Leninist notions and the concomitant spread of literacy.

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 7:50 pm
by Rvaughn

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:15 am
by KeithE

Re: Imagine a Better America

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:15 am
by Sandy
The "tax cut" wasn't enough, among those who are most likely to spend money, to last very long. I've heard analysis of it call it everything from a "sugar high" to a "sub-stimulus." My refund check hasn't arrived yet, so I still have to spend the couple of extra dollars I got back so I can stimulate the economy.

In spite of the job growth numbers, which have been very irregular, unemployment keeps inching up again. So the losses are exceeding the gains.

Cost of living varies quite a bit from place to place. Expecting that someone can, or should, be able to live on what it takes for you to live on is really not a fair comparison. In Texas, there was no personal income tax. Sounds great, but we paid more of our taxable income in taxes in Texas than we did in Pennsylvania, with a personal income tax. School districts and other entities in Texas, who get less from the state than in places where there's a state income tax, wind up taking a bigger share. In Texas, our energy bill, mainly electricity, was massive, 14 cents per kwh, loaded with taxes. Here in relatively expensive Chicago, we pay 3.85 cents and no sales tax on utilities. I honestly do not see how someone could raise two kids on an income of less than $50,000.