Trump did good

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Trump did good

Postby Jon Estes » Thu Nov 01, 2018 12:12 am

I am proud of the President I didn't vote for. I am proud of his visit to Pittsburgh to the synagogue to pay respect and to the hospital where wounded police officers were being treated. I was glad to see some people from the city I spent a lot of time in, come out and greet him and his family. A good day for America.

https://www.facebook.com/whitehousebrief/videos/316377875810438/UzpfSTY2MDIwMjU1MjoxMDE1NTU4MTA1MjI5MjU1Mw/
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Haruo » Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:24 pm

The visit was in poor taste. The rabbi and the mayor and the county executive, I heard, all asked him not to come until after the funerals, but he went anyway in what looks like a blatant attempt to politicize the community's grief, to his own and his party's profit, in the run-up to the midterms. Not something to be proud of.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Sandy » Thu Nov 01, 2018 7:41 pm

In all honesty, he'd have been criticized if he didn't go as well. That's just the nature of divisive, partisan politics. The right wing blasted the Mayor for saying he shouldn't come, though the Mayor explained that the logistics would be easier later on. President Obama was always the target of vitriolic, bile-filled spew from the right regardless of whether he showed up, or decided to stay away because of logistics.

While I don't think we have ever had a president who was more deserving of having to run into protesters everywhere he goes, and it is heartwarming to see them show up in such large numbers, I think the protesters should have backed off on this one. He made a remark that there was a "small" protest kept far away from him, and they were kept away from Squirrel Hill. But Pittsburgh is a hilly town, and there were thousands of protesters on streets that were visible along his route from the airport to Squirrel Hill, and the designated protest area was jammed. Save that for Tuesday.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Jon Estes » Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:42 pm

Haruo wrote:The visit was in poor taste. The rabbi and the mayor and the county executive, I heard, all asked him not to come until after the funerals, but he went anyway in what looks like a blatant attempt to politicize the community's grief, to his own and his party's profit, in the run-up to the midterms. Not something to be proud of.


Looks are deceiving. I think he and his lovely wife went out of a heart of compassion for what happened. That opposition to his coming was expected. He goes anywhere for anything, there is opposition.

The poor taste was in the protestors who believed it was more important to protest than let the moments of remembrance and show of compassion pass. It is sad the show for the hate for Trump was more important to some people than the loss of the loves being remembered.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Sandy » Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:55 pm

Jon Estes wrote: Looks are deceiving. I think he and his lovely wife went out of a heart of compassion for what happened.


I wouldn't go that far. I don't think he's capable of compassion. She may be, but isn't able to bring it off well. Regardless, he needed to go. The way the right excoriated Obama at every turn like this, and as horrible and ineffective as this administration has been, protesters should be antiticipated. I think the size and scope of the Pittsburgh protest took him by surprise, but they should have waited to throw their party.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Rvaughn » Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:46 am

Haruo wrote:The rabbi and the mayor and the county executive, I heard, all asked him not to come....
According to what I have read, this is not true of the Rabbi who was serving at the time of the shooting, Jeffrey Myers.
“The president of the United States is always welcome,” [Rabbi Jeffrey Myers] said in an interview on CNN. “I’m a citizen, he’s my president. He is certainly welcome.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/29/us/pittsburgh-synagogue-rabbi.html
https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/01/politics/rabbi-jeffrey-myers-meeting-donald-trump-cnntv/index.html
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Sandy » Fri Nov 02, 2018 10:00 am

There were several congregations that met in the same building and I think one of the other Rabbis said something about Trump staying away. Noting that they all mentioned logistics and interference with funerals, including the Mayor, the shrieking and lip flapping from the right about their request that he stay away being "political" is unwarranted. I understand that Trump's incompetence, ineptness, ineffectiveness and his whole attitude and demeanor warrants the protests, as does the behavior of the right during President Obama's term when he visited a shooting site or a disaster site, but I think the attention here was better focused on the victims and the horror of yet another shooting than on general displeasure with an incompetent, immoral politician.

Of course, if he'd been a little more careful about his words and signals and his close associations with the alt-right the shooter might not have been so inspired to attack a synagogue and eleven people would still be alive. Calling yourself a "nationalist" while being racially, politically and religiously selective about your immigration policy set this nut case off. How many others are out there, thinking that this is now OK? Not to mention the lax gun registration and laws that made it easy for him to get his hands on weapons.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Neil Heath » Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:17 pm

Perhaps one of the telling scenes from his visit was his arrival at the airport. No one came to meet him. That spoke volumes.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Jon Estes » Fri Nov 02, 2018 10:47 pm

Neil Heath wrote:Perhaps one of the telling scenes from his visit was his arrival at the airport. No one came to meet him. That spoke volumes.


Liberal politicians refusing to greet Trump... not telling... expected.

Sad commentary on support for the victims from Mayor and others. Like or dislike... showing sympathy for the victims should not be a place one shows contempt for those they hate... for the sake of the family and the country.

Trump won this one.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Dave Roberts » Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:36 am

I just don't see any winners when all those in public leadership do not work together. Winning in a time of pain seems antithetical to caring about people. I feel that while the President's visit was expected, he should have respected Jewish customs not to have public events until all the funerals were over. In national grief moments, being mourner in chief is not a great duty. Jared and Ivanka's presence was much more in line since they were part of the same faith community.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Sandy » Sat Nov 03, 2018 3:31 pm

Jon Estes wrote:
Neil Heath wrote:Perhaps one of the telling scenes from his visit was his arrival at the airport. No one came to meet him. That spoke volumes.


Liberal politicians refusing to greet Trump... not telling... expected.

Sad commentary on support for the victims from Mayor and others. Like or dislike... showing sympathy for the victims should not be a place one shows contempt for those they hate... for the sake of the family and the country.

Trump won this one.


Not all of the officials in Pittsburgh, or the county, are liberals. None of the conservatives showed up either. Maybe he should have promoted it as a rally, though his crowds at those are notably thining as well.

The reality of this event is that Jews were singled out and murdered in a synagogue in America. To make a statement like "Trump won this one" is to completely and totally miss the whole point. That's exactly what the alt-right, white supremacist, anti-semites who brought this horrible act about are banking on. If your analysis of this situation is that Trump won, then so did white supremacy and anti-semitism.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Neil Heath » Sat Nov 03, 2018 7:08 pm

I noticed McConnell and Ryan were also too busy to join him on that trip.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Jon Estes » Sun Nov 04, 2018 3:00 am

Neil Heath wrote:I noticed McConnell and Ryan were also too busy to join him on that trip.


Since you noticed they were too busy... assuming you got an inside scoop to why they did not join the trip... what were they too busy doing?

Was what you noticed reality or an assumption (you really don't know why) to make a point that you cannot support?

I noticed you didn't join in on the trip... I'm guessing you weren't invited. If I am wrong, please correct me. I wish not to speculate on why others do or don't do things.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Neil Heath » Sun Nov 04, 2018 6:52 pm

The news report said they had previous commitments, but did not say what those were. I think there were some others mentioned who also declined, but I don't recall their names. I read that as being too busy to come when invited by the White House to join him. I don't know their motives, I'm just reporting their behavior. Like you I'm not speculating.

As for me, I can report accurately that I was not invited. No need to guess any more, Jon. I was not surprised to be overlooked. I would have declined if asked. :)

I agree with the local leaders that it was not good timing to come there. They urged him to wait until after the funerals were done. I agree that their first priority was attending those services and supporting their grieving community. And I was not surprised that no one met him at the airport, because they were busy doing what they should have been doing.
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Re: Trump did good

Postby Sandy » Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:36 pm

By going to Pittsburgh, Trump did something that would have been expected of any president. His presence drew attention to a tragedy and regardless of any political perspective, he needed to be there. The question was about the timing of his visit. The public officials and some of the synagogue leaders, knowing that his presence would spark protests, wanted him to wait until after the funerals because of the logistics involved in having to cordon off a part of town and interfering with those wanting to be part of the funerals in the process. He came, there were protesters, though they avoided the area where the funerals were being held, they made their point, and many of them showed their solidarity and support for the families of the victims.

I agree that it is telling that no one showed up at the airport to greet him. For a president who thrives on political rallies and loves to be a cheerleader of inane, sensless lines ("lock her up" being a favorite) not to have supporters greet him had to be deflating to his ego. It is also telling that none of the Republicans in the area running for re-election showed up for photo ops. Maybe that's because support from Trump cost the Republicans a congressional seat in a heavily Republican district (more than a 20% advantage) in this area in a high turnout special election this past spring.

I think he missed an opportunity to denounce the alt-right, white supremacist, white nationalist ideology that was behind the shooter's motivation to pull this off. Oh, he muttered some relatively unemotional words about the shooting being despicable and bringing the guy to justice, but he's only a couple of weeks away from declaring himself to be a "Nationalist," which is a dog-whistle term to those kinds of folks. To really do something to his credit regarding this particular shooting would require him to remove a number of individuals from his administration and permanently call out and denounce others who helped him campaign and whom he gave jobs, like Steve Bannon. If he wants a political "win" out of this, he'll have to do a lot more than he's done.
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