Black female governor for GA?

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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Jon Estes » Sun Oct 14, 2018 5:28 am

Haruo wrote:
William Thornton wrote:GOP candidate Kemp will have to crash and burn to lose.

One can always dream, and hope. Even if she comes within a point or three it'll be significant.

I'm good with the DEMS shouting victory for coming close at all the losses they get. Maybe we can get the DEM losers a participation trophy.

And there's way too much time left to have a clue what "Trumpier than Trump" will mean in November as far as getting out the votes (and on both sides in this case).
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Sandy » Sun Oct 14, 2018 5:47 pm

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... -6628.html

And that's a conservative composite poll. If Kemp has to "self destruct" to lose, then he must've pulled the plug on the grenade he was holding. A Republican trump boot licker in a southern state should be in better than a "toss up" race.

This is a typical Republican tactic to suppress the vote. Claim that it is an ID issue. It's not. Kemp has control of the registration, and he's seeking out registrations in heavily African American areas to randomly cancel, or to create problems. It's a straw man issue. There are few actual cases of genuine voter fraud and even if there were, in Georgia with the Republicans in charge of the system, they would be at fault.

If an African American female is drawing the kind of money from inside the state that she is, and get the kind of polling numbers she is, in Georgia, it bodes well for Democrats in other parts of the country.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby William Thornton » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:07 pm

I love an optimist. Kemps a weak candidate. Still, if Abrams wins it will be quite notable. Darling of the libs.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Sandy » Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:52 am

William Thornton wrote:I love an optimist. Kemps a weak candidate. Still, if Abrams wins it will be quite notable. Darling of the libs.


I gather that Georgia doesn't like to be compared to Alabama, however, it has similar constituencies though the gap between Democrats and Republicans seems to be smaller because Georgia does have one somewhat cosmopolitan city, and the coast seems to be progressive. The Dems won a statewide election in Alabama by registering a long-inactive segment of the population sympathetic to Democrats but not really participating because they didn't think they had a chance. The Republicans used the "weak candidate" claim, though Moore got more votes than previous Republicans had in contested elections. In the final tally, the Democrats found and registered about 400,000 new voters, and got them and the rest of their constituency to the polls, and overcame a 30 point margin to pull it off. Commentators I've heard say that what has happened in Georgia is a similar occurrence, that the Ossoff-Handel election activated an inactive segment of voters, and since then, Abrams campaign has been full steam ahead on new voter registrations, which is why there is a slowdown in the secretary of state's office. They saw Alabama, see the stream of new registrations coming in from the heavily African American counties, and the blue areas of the state and it rang alarm bells. A month out, Abrams and Kemp are in a toss-up. A month out in Alabama, Jones was still down by 7.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby William Thornton » Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:28 am

If it comes out that Kemp liked teeny boppers, I'd expect him to lose. He is fairly easy to like, unlike the perpetually angry and idiotic Moore. I wouldn't have voted for Moore even without the teen dating stuff.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Jon Estes » Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:27 am

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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Joseph Patrick » Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:53 am



From Gerry Milligan...Jon, I do not want to upset the three of you who watch FAUX (FOX) news, but this clip claiming that Stacey Abrams is advocating for undocumented people to vote for her is highly suspect (for me it is highly suspect just because of the source). BUT, if she did this, it would be up to Kemp, as Secretary of State for Georgia, to invalidate those ballots. By the way, why has Kemp not sat with any credible news source for an interview? Afraid to answer hard questions?
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Sandy » Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:21 pm

Joseph Patrick wrote:


From Gerry Milligan...Jon, I do not want to upset the three of you who watch FAUX (FOX) news, but this clip claiming that Stacey Abrams is advocating for undocumented people to vote for her is highly suspect (for me it is highly suspect just because of the source). BUT, if she did this, it would be up to Kemp, as Secretary of State for Georgia, to invalidate those ballots. By the way, why has Kemp not sat with any credible news source for an interview? Afraid to answer hard questions?


I haven't seen that from a credible source, though it is making the rounds of the odds and ends extremist right wing media wannabees. There's a similar story going out about Democratic candidates for congress and senate in various states, depending on where and who, that they "voted" for a piece of legislation that would let sex offenders live next to schools. It's the Rush Limbaugh approach, say it, claim that it is true, see if it sticks and don't worry about it.

Stoking up fear of people who are different doesn't seem to be taking too much of a different course than it once did in Georgia when African Americans were required to pass a literacy test before getting to register to vote.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Jon Estes » Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:07 pm

Joseph Patrick wrote:


From Gerry Milligan...Jon, I do not want to upset the three of you who watch FAUX (FOX) news, but this clip claiming that Stacey Abrams is advocating for undocumented people to vote for her is highly suspect (for me it is highly suspect just because of the source). BUT, if she did this, it would be up to Kemp, as Secretary of State for Georgia, to invalidate those ballots. By the way, why has Kemp not sat with any credible news source for an interview? Afraid to answer hard questions?


We all choose our sources.. I'm sure I would find yours suspect.

the video clip Shows hersaying who makes up the blue wave... Document and undocumented.

You know your sources want say a thing.

Credibility is seen differently by each of us... Oh well.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Haruo » Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:48 pm

It appears there is a point on which Abrams and Trump are in agreement.

There are also undocumented immigrants in the GOP base, probably not as many I would guess, but a guess is all it would be. I've actually seen more hard evidence of this than I have of the undocked blue ballots. But not much can be done to make the whole question more than anecdotal-cum-speculative, far as I can see.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Sandy » Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:02 pm

There have been so few voter fraud cases involving "undocumented" workers, it's not on anyone's radar screen. It's good talk around supporters of orange hair, but that's about it. And while this Abrams video looks pieced together and taken out of context, it's pretty clear she is not an advocate for undocumented workers voting, though she clearly is saying that they are included in all of her constituency. It's become an issue that allows Republicans to legitimize the kind of voter suppression they need to win elections, especially in places like Georgia, where the black vote can make a big difference if it turns out. According to Rachel Maddow, Secretary of State Kemp has suppressed and messed with the voter registration of more than 600,000 mostly African American Georgians. And this recent suppression is aimed at the mid-terms because his lead has shrunk down to, well, nothing. Race is a toss up.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Jon Estes » Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:05 pm

Sandy wrote:There have been so few voter fraud cases involving "undocumented" workers, it's not on anyone's radar screen. It's good talk around supporters of orange hair, but that's about it. And while this Abrams video looks pieced together and taken out of context, it's pretty clear she is not an advocate for undocumented workers voting, though she clearly is saying that they are included in all of her constituency. It's become an issue that allows Republicans to legitimize the kind of voter suppression they need to win elections, especially in places like Georgia, where the black vote can make a big difference if it turns out. According to Rachel Maddow, Secretary of State Kemp has suppressed and messed with the voter registration of more than 600,000 mostly African American Georgians. And this recent suppression is aimed at the mid-terms because his lead has shrunk down to, well, nothing. Race is a toss up.


To speak against non Americans voting is suppression?

It could probably be better defined as collusion.

Rachel Marcos... LOL
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Haruo » Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:25 pm

Jon Estes wrote:
Sandy wrote:There have been so few voter fraud cases involving "undocumented" workers, it's not on anyone's radar screen. It's good talk around supporters of orange hair, but that's about it. And while this Abrams video looks pieced together and taken out of context, it's pretty clear she is not an advocate for undocumented workers voting, though she clearly is saying that they are included in all of her constituency. It's become an issue that allows Republicans to legitimize the kind of voter suppression they need to win elections, especially in places like Georgia, where the black vote can make a big difference if it turns out. According to Rachel Maddow, Secretary of State Kemp has suppressed and messed with the voter registration of more than 600,000 mostly African American Georgians. And this recent suppression is aimed at the mid-terms because his lead has shrunk down to, well, nothing. Race is a toss up.


To speak against non Americans voting is suppression?

It could probably be better defined as collusion.

Rachel Marcos... LOL

Jon, can you point me to any solid source of information showing that those whose registrations were put on hold were not American citizens?
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Jon Estes » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:25 am

Haruo wrote:
Jon Estes wrote:
Sandy wrote:There have been so few voter fraud cases involving "undocumented" workers, it's not on anyone's radar screen. It's good talk around supporters of orange hair, but that's about it. And while this Abrams video looks pieced together and taken out of context, it's pretty clear she is not an advocate for undocumented workers voting, though she clearly is saying that they are included in all of her constituency. It's become an issue that allows Republicans to legitimize the kind of voter suppression they need to win elections, especially in places like Georgia, where the black vote can make a big difference if it turns out. According to Rachel Maddow, Secretary of State Kemp has suppressed and messed with the voter registration of more than 600,000 mostly African American Georgians. And this recent suppression is aimed at the mid-terms because his lead has shrunk down to, well, nothing. Race is a toss up.


To speak against non Americans voting is suppression?

It could probably be better defined as collusion.

Rachel Marcos... LOL

Jon, can you point me to any solid source of information showing that those whose registrations were put on hold were not American citizens?


I didn't make that claim.

I'm speaking directly to Sandy and his suppression comment in relation to the collusion cry.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Dave Roberts » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:19 am

William Thornton wrote:Hooey, hooey, and hooey. Voter registration is a joke. Anyone who wants to vote should have a confirmed identity. I have to show my ID at the poll and match my name and address on the roll. So should everyone else. This is another page in the dem playbook.

I'm voting for one dem in the statewide races..for sec of state. Guy I know. Only dem in the state that isn't a soros, pelosi, schumer pawn.


The only problem with state issued voter id is that the state does not issue them for free when the voter registers. In VA, for example, along with several other states, the DMV issues photo ID's for which they charge $10 to $16 depending on the term for which they are good (5 to 8 years), which amounts to a poll tax. I have no problem with id requirement, but I have a lot of trouble with making them expensive and hard to get. Not every community has a DMV office which means some folks can be 50 miles away from the centers that issue the photo ID's. Requiring the ID's is no problem, but the way they are issued is.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Sandy » Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:21 am

https://www.salon.com/2018/10/14/rachel ... n_partner/

The registrations being cancelled are not "non-Americans." Most of them are African Americans in predominantly African American precincts. Translated, they are non-white, non-Republican voters.

Even more ridiculous is the requirement that in order to vote in North Dakota, people have to provide a street address rather than a P.O. Box. So, something like two thirds of the residents of the Standing Rock Indian Reservation will have their right to vote taken away intentionally, because there are no street addresses on the reservation and they are the voting block that made the difference in the election of a Democrat to the Senate from North Dakota the last time.

The claim that "non-Americans" vote and affect election outcomes is just another Trump lie and more fear trumped up by racist bigotry.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Dave Roberts » Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:46 am

Sandy wrote:https://www.salon.com/2018/10/14/rachel-maddow-shames-georgia-secretary-of-state-on-racially-driven-voter-suppression_partner/

The registrations being cancelled are not "non-Americans." Most of them are African Americans in predominantly African American precincts. Translated, they are non-white, non-Republican voters.

Even more ridiculous is the requirement that in order to vote in North Dakota, people have to provide a street address rather than a P.O. Box. So, something like two thirds of the residents of the Standing Rock Indian Reservation will have their right to vote taken away intentionally, because there are no street addresses on the reservation and they are the voting block that made the difference in the election of a Democrat to the Senate from North Dakota the last time.

The claim that "non-Americans" vote and affect election outcomes is just another Trump lie and more fear trumped up by racist bigotry.


That also is a way to disenfranchise rural voters of very small towns where mail is not delivered to houses so everyone has to have a post office box or claim it at "general delivery." I have pastored in two communities that did not have in-town mail delivery.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Haruo » Tue Oct 16, 2018 3:37 pm

Sandy wrote:There have been so few voter fraud cases involving "undocumented" workers, it's not on anyone's radar screen. It's good talk around supporters of orange hair, but that's about it. And while this Abrams video looks pieced together and taken out of context, it's pretty clear she is not an advocate for undocumented workers voting, though she clearly is saying that they are included in all of her constituency. It's become an issue that allows Republicans to legitimize the kind of voter suppression they need to win elections, especially in places like Georgia, where the black vote can make a big difference if it turns out. According to Rachel Maddow, Secretary of State Kemp has suppressed and messed with the voter registration of more than 600,000 mostly African American Georgians. And this recent suppression is aimed at the mid-terms because his lead has shrunk down to, well, nothing. Race is a toss up.


Jon Estes wrote:To speak against non Americans voting is suppression?

It could probably be better defined as collusion.

Rachel Marcos... LOL

Haruo wrote:Jon, can you point me to any solid source of information showing that those whose registrations were put on hold were not American citizens?


Jon Estes wrote:I didn't make that claim.

I'm speaking directly to Sandy and his suppression comment in relation to the collusion cry.

Okay, I don't see where what you quoted Sandy as saying above anywhere suggests that "speaking against non Americans voting" is "suppression". The suppression Sandy referred to (and/or that he said Rachel Maddow (I don't get the Marcos bit) referred to) did not involve non-Americans. Black Georgians are by and large Americans.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Neil Heath » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:28 pm

To clarify the charge of undocumented voters that came up, I'm told she was talking about the "blue wave" as including lots of different people groups, white, black, gay, straight, dreamers, etc. But she was not saying they were all voters. Just that they were part of the coming change.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Jon Estes » Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:55 am

Neil Heath wrote:To clarify the charge of undocumented voters that came up, I'm told she was talking about the "blue wave" as including lots of different people groups, white, black, gay, straight, dreamers, etc. But she was not saying they were all voters. Just that they were part of the coming change.


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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Sandy » Wed Oct 17, 2018 12:39 pm

Neil Heath wrote:To clarify the charge of undocumented voters that came up, I'm told she was talking about the "blue wave" as including lots of different people groups, white, black, gay, straight, dreamers, etc. But she was not saying they were all voters. Just that they were part of the coming change.


Figured the extremist right wing media created a completely different context to bring their headline. Illegals voting in elections has been such an infinitesimally small issue, it's just a sign of how desperate the GOP is, even in Georgia, if this is all they can bring up. Someone might need to check Kemp's phone records and see how many calls he's placed from Atlanta to Moscow these days. :-) . She's pulled ahead in a couple of the polls and is running even in the composites, all she needs is for orange hair to have one of his rallies in Georgia to tip the balance her way, as it seems to be doing elsewhere.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby William Thornton » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:12 pm

Well, the Democratic Socialists of America did say "Abrams fights the good fight."

Tuition grants and free college for illegal immigrants, abolish ICE...the usual dem stuff.

Three weeks...we'll see.
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Joseph Patrick » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:43 pm

From Gerry Milligan

William, you said, “Not a snowball's chance in Gehenna. But let's dream:” and later said: “I hear that Abrams needs about 25% of the white vote. Not sure she can get there. She's a good candidate.” and then, “Abrams would sandblast Lee, Davis, and Jackson off of Stone Mountain.” And finally, “Tuition grants and free college for illegal immigrants, abolish ICE...the usual dem stuff."

About two assertions you have made...Stone Mountain and Free tuition for illegal immigrants...I have read Stacy Abrams web site and could not find either of these assertions. Could you point me to the documentation?
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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby Jon Estes » Thu Oct 18, 2018 3:35 am

Joseph Patrick wrote:From Gerry Milligan

William, you said, “Not a snowball's chance in Gehenna. But let's dream:” and later said: “I hear that Abrams needs about 25% of the white vote. Not sure she can get there. She's a good candidate.” and then, “Abrams would sandblast Lee, Davis, and Jackson off of Stone Mountain.” And finally, “Tuition grants and free college for illegal immigrants, abolish ICE...the usual dem stuff."

About two assertions you have made...Stone Mountain and Free tuition for illegal immigrants...I have read Stacy Abrams web site and could not find either of these assertions. Could you point me to the documentation?


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Re: Black female governor for GA?

Postby William Thornton » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:02 am

https://politics.myajc.com/blog/politic ... Vb79LdVMJ/

She is somewhat equivocal on the matter lately...with the election pending.

https://www.ajc.com/news/state--regiona ... XPIadclyL/

Her campaign doesn't deny that she appeared before the DSA group. They like her.

https://politics.myajc.com/blog/politic ... olWfWE6UJ/

The issue is the GA lottery tuition scholarship being given to non-citizens. Abrams would certainly like to change the current prohibition on the matter.
__________

Not on Abrams' campaign site, you say? Well, I wouldn't expect these things to be.

I doubt many people are left whose mind may be changed on the candidates. The goal is turnout. There are worse Dems than Abrams and better Reps than Kemp. Unfortunately, we have to choose between the two. I'll vote for Kemp. Not much of a decision to be made there.
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