Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

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Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Sandy » Tue May 30, 2017 11:53 am

http://religiondispatches.org/a-pence-p ... its-money/

Stephen finds these pieces. He's posted a fair collection of them here over the years, usually to prove a point, but frequently disconnected from the real point he wants to make.

Other than a brief hiatus during the Reagan years from the staunchly Democratic, labor union, populism that I grew up with, I've stayed away from right wing Evangelical politics. Though I've never seen this particular term before--Christopher Hutchins book, American Fascists being probably the closest I've seen connecting the ideology of fascism to right wing Christian politics--this kind of ideology is one reason I've avoided the political right. For one thing, the "all or nothing" commitment required of politicians on the issues makes common sense consideration of most positions impossible and blatantly inconsistent. If you're a right winger, you have to be for protecting the unborn, and against protecting anyone from exploitation in health insurance or health care. You can't be pro-life, and pro-union. I think that's ridiculous. You've sold out your faith if your politics overwhelms its identity.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Haruo » Tue May 30, 2017 12:12 pm

That sort of all-or-nothingism is all too prevalent on the left, too.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Sandy » Tue May 30, 2017 3:34 pm

It is, unfortunately, though I have to say, the Democratic party precinct meetings and regional conventions I've gone to usually feature a lot of back and forth discussion, and I've never had my mic cut off for bringing up something that's not completely consistent with the standard agenda. More things are negotiable, and more things get voted on.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Lou » Tue May 30, 2017 4:06 pm

Haruo wrote:That sort of all-or-nothingism is all too prevalent on the left, too.


Amen, and amen. Something I find troubling, especially in light of the bipartisan rancor that characterizes the current political discourse, is the totally false "we're good/they're evil" dichotomous narrative that both republicans and democrats seem to be entrenched in. Last time I checked, Romans 3:23 is talking about all of us--and I think Paul's statement applies to political parties as well as individuals, since the 1st is made up of the 2nd. Whether you're repub or dem, if you talk only about the vices of the other guys but only about the virtues of your own chosen party or politician, you're not being a prophetic voice in or to the culture; you're making yourself a tool of one or the other of the parties.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Tim Bonney » Tue May 30, 2017 4:47 pm

Haruo wrote:That sort of all-or-nothingism is all too prevalent on the left, too.


I've yet to see left wing religious liberal extremist blow up anything, start a holy war, or take over a national government. I can think of plenty examples of holy wars and destruction made in the name of religious orthodoxy.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Haruo » Wed May 31, 2017 11:01 am

Timothy Bonney wrote:
Haruo wrote:That sort of all-or-nothingism is all too prevalent on the left, too.


I've yet to see left wing religious liberal extremist blow up anything, start a holy war, or take over a national government. I can think of plenty examples of holy wars and destruction made in the name of religious orthodoxy.

True, I'm not talking about actual warfare, but about the kind of internecine intolerance of diversity that, say, refuses to support a local Democratic candidate because of his (or her) personal beliefs (not proposed legislative actions) about a particular topic, usually either gun control or abortion.

Some feminists supported Hillary over Bernie on grounds that made it sound to me like they would rather vote for Maggie Thatcher than for a man. It wasn't the choice of Hillary over Bernie that irked me, but the imputation that those who made the other choice were dissing all womankind. Gloria Steinem and Madeleine Albright weren't the only ones who irritated me along these lines, I have friends (folkies, and high school classmates) who made the same kind of to my mind objectionable imputations.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Haruo » Wed May 31, 2017 11:07 am

Which strikes me as the mirror image of the "I would vote for [Hitler/Satan/Pol Pot...] as long as he would reverse Roe v. Wade" verbiage Evangelical Republicans occasionally (frequently?) come out with.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Tim Bonney » Wed May 31, 2017 11:14 am

Haruo wrote:
True, I'm not talking about actual warfare, but about the kind of internecine intolerance of diversity that, say, refuses to support a local Democratic candidate because of his (or her) personal beliefs (not proposed legislative actions) about a particular topic, usually either gun control or abortion.


I've not seen much of that in Iowa Haruo. I'm betting you will start to see far less of it as many Dems I know are now terrified of voting for anyone in the GOP at any level post-Trump.
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Re: Christofascism--First time I've heard this term

Postby Sandy » Wed May 31, 2017 1:32 pm

Haruo wrote:Some feminists supported Hillary over Bernie on grounds that made it sound to me like they would rather vote for Maggie Thatcher than for a man. It wasn't the choice of Hillary over Bernie that irked me, but the imputation that those who made the other choice were dissing all womankind. Gloria Steinem and Madeleine Albright weren't the only ones who irritated me along these lines, I have friends (folkies, and high school classmates) who made the same kind of to my mind objectionable imputations.


It's not like the feminist position winds up completely empty handed with Bernie. I sort of get the point, but from a policy perspective, there really wouldn't have been a difference. What if the choice were Bernie vs. Sarah Palin? Where are women's rights then?

But what you see in the author's characterization of Christofascism is different than the kind of expected conformity you see on the left. It's rooted in the belief that America as a Christian nation is not fulfilling its purpose until it becomes theocratic. Abortion rights get high priority without compromise because it creates an ideological battle that can be used to draw voters in who might otherwise not necessarily support candidates who advocate for instituting other things that aren't as clear cut from a Biblical perspective. Loving your enemies, the socialist, communal nature of the early church, and Jesus' teaching about the poor are completely left out of the picture, and in fact policy is developed which runs counter to those values. Foreign policy wraps completely around a futurist eschatological view. What makes it fascist is imposing these views on all of society, including people of other religions, those who profess no religion, and Christians who don't accept this particular set of literalist opinions.
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Wayne Flynt gettin at same concern

Postby Stephen Fox » Fri Jun 02, 2017 4:37 pm

Google for the article if this link brings an intercept.

Evangelicals lost God and found Trump, Financial times.

Worth the search. Spotlights Bruce Gourley's PH D advisor and Harper Lee's good friend Wayne Flynt.
https://www.ft.com/content/b41d0ee6-1e9 ... 3f5a7f229c

And Sarah Pulliam Bailey has piece today on climate change and evangelicals in Wash Post.
"I'm the only sane {person} in here." Doyle Hargraves, Slingblade
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http://www.foxofbama.blogspot.com or google asfoxseesit
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Something else in the ballpark

Postby Stephen Fox » Tue Jun 06, 2017 12:34 pm

"I'm the only sane {person} in here." Doyle Hargraves, Slingblade
"Midget, Broom; Helluva campaign". Political consultant, "Oh, Brother..."


http://www.foxofbama.blogspot.com or google asfoxseesit
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Re: Wayne Flynt gettin at same concern

Postby Sandy » Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:08 am

Stephen Fox wrote:Google for the article if this link brings an intercept.

Evangelicals lost God and found Trump, Financial times.

Worth the search. Spotlights Bruce Gourley's PH D advisor and Harper Lee's good friend Wayne Flynt.
https://www.ft.com/content/b41d0ee6-1e9 ... 3f5a7f229c

And Sarah Pulliam Bailey has piece today on climate change and evangelicals in Wash Post.


Best link you've ever posted, Stephen.
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