Subsidies

[KeithE]

.

After a brief discussion of how NFL teams are subsidized to the tune of $1B/year, this articles details the subsidies given to:

- Oil and Gas ($10-52B/year from US alone, estimated $500B internationally)
- Fishing Industry ($35B/year)
- Agricultural Businesses ($221B/year, 2/3 to wealthy companies and does not include funding of Monsanto, Dupont in pesticide development)

Do our “free enterprise” brethren herein object? I hoping we might actually agree on this point.

[William Thornton]

Milk...sugar...clergy...

[KeithE]

[William Thornton]

I like my income exclusion tax break...have never had a subsidy.

The milk and sugar should be ended.

[ET]

Fine with me, but if you end 'em for one, end them for EVERYBODY.

[KeithE]

Clergy us indeed different. The purist in me, says stop the entanglement of religion with any form of government subsidy including housing allowance (strict separation).

I do believe that when some technology is needed but too risky for industry to delve into, Government should subsidize basic research for a period NTE 5 years and license it to industry through competitive procurements for production/distribution.

[William Thornton]

[KeithE]

[William Thornton]

I don't see the HA as constituting an establishment of religion nor excessive entanglement.

[Ed Pettibone]

Ed: Keith, I have never heard of Empty Tomb who or what are they?

The stat that reads "the Under-25 years group directed 84% of their giving to "church, religious organizations," is bit convoluted IMHO. 84% of their giving means little w/o knowing what the real numbers of their giving is compare too the other age groups listed.

If they are not using smoke and mirrors I would prefer to see the numbers for each age group provided in the same order.

And as I have previously said, I also have conflicted feeling about the housing allowance due to personal benefit.

[KeithE]

[Ed Pettibone]

Keith, I read the statement you quote in context, that is why I question its value.

I know what they said but I question their motive, That is why I asked about them.

Having worked in co-operation with many groups seeking to "do good and help the poor" I see your statement that "I could quibble but hey any group trying to help the poor is good as far as I'm concerned" as being gullible. I'll ask would that include the SBC.

[KeithE]

[Dave Roberts]

If there is an end to clergy housing allowance exemptions, then does the government also have to end the housing allowance exemption for other professions--particularly for the military. The original premise for both was that members of both the military and the clergy had to relocate and find housing where they would not have been likely to have lived. It seems the two are bound in their logic at the congressional level.

[William Thornton]

[William Thornton]

To answer your question on the military HA, theirs was not challenged in the lawsuit and would not be affected.

[KeithE]

[William Thornton]

Completely different issue, Keith. Gummit didn't single out any certain population to be the beneficiary of their largess as they did with clergy. Also, the great beneficiaries in SS are low income people and system gamers who get far more than they pay in. Any argument for removing the SS tax cap is merely another soak the rich scheme.

It's a good topic but belongs in its own thread.

[Dave Roberts]

[William Thornton]

[KeithE]

[William Thornton]

Mass transit subsidies are a colossal boondoggle. Atlanta, gridlocked by a 2inch snowfall, is trying to get big bucks for a trolley service. The city's mass transit, MARTA, is a notorious money loser this is practically permanently dysfunctional. They once had a board chair that was a public housing resident, i.e. no job, no record of achievement.
No local gummit would spend money this way since taxpayers would see what a waste their money goes to but as a political system that makes some constituencies happy it works fairly well.

[William Thornton]

Gummit support of oil exploration etc may have a compelling argument. I am not familiar with all the arguments on all the gummit favored industries and occupations as I am with my own.

[KeithE]

[William Thornton]

Right, got it. Soak the rich.