Global Refugees

The place to discuss politics and policy issues that are not directly related to matters of faith.

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Re: Global Refugees

Postby Sandy » Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:06 am

Jon Estes wrote:As far as I know and have heard, Trump is not trying to stop those coming legally.


Not an accurate statement. Trump has issued executive orders attempting to stop legal entry by persons who live in predominantly Muslim countries, and has altered the laws that allow persons to cross into the US and apply for asylum.
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby Rvaughn » Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:33 am

Sandy wrote:
Jon Estes wrote:As far as I know and have heard, Trump is not trying to stop those coming legally.

Not an accurate statement. Trump has issued executive orders attempting to stop legal entry by persons who live in predominantly Muslim countries, and has altered the laws that allow persons to cross into the US and apply for asylum.
Sandy and Jon, I think your statements are too general and simplistic. Trump's executive orders have been subject to litigation and there have been court findings against them. On the other hand, two proclamations -- Presidential Proclamations 9645 and 9723 -- have survived and are still in place. Presidential Proclamation 9645 (signed by the President on September 24, 2017) restricted entry into the United States for certain people from eight different countries -- Chad, Iran, Libya, North Korea, Somalia, Syria, Venezuela, and Yemen. (Presidential Proclamation 9723 removed Chad from the list.)
In a 5-4 decision, with the majority opinion authored by Chief Justice John Roberts, the Supreme Court issued two core holdings: (a) that the latest ban does not exceed the president’s authority under the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA); and (b) that ban does not violate the Establishment Clause of the Constitution.
The Supreme Court Travel Ban Ruling: A Summary

Not only have individuals disagreed on the legality and Constitutionality of these matters, so have various courts.
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby Sandy » Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:23 pm

The difference between the set of executive orders that was rejected by the court and the one they upheld was that the latter included countries that were not predominantly Muslim. A competent president would have done some research and found out if there had been any specific issues or patterns regarding immigration and visas from particular countries but we don't have that, so this one just tossed in a couple of countries he didn't like, North Korea and Venezuela, to get past the establishment clause violation that his first order violated.
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby KeithE » Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:39 pm

Jon,

Before you leave (or not), can you answer my question often posed to you - Why do you support Trump?

Free reign - I will not counter whatever you say. Just trying to understand (and make you think).
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby JE Pettibone » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:52 am

KeithE wrote:Jon,

Before you leave (or not), can you answer my question often posed to you - Why do you support Trump?

Free reign - I will not counter whatever you say. Just trying to understand (and make you think).


Ed: And Keith, what is your need to know why Jon ( or anyone else) supports Trump. What are you trying to understand, and what is it that you believe Jon needs to think. I do not always think as Jon does, but in the many threads in which I have disagreed with him I have never perceived him as not thinking.

Personally I hope he stays around.
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby Dave Roberts » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:57 am

JE Pettibone wrote:
KeithE wrote:Jon,

Before you leave (or not), can you answer my question often posed to you - Why do you support Trump?

Free reign - I will not counter whatever you say. Just trying to understand (and make you think).


Ed: And Keith, what is your need to know why Jon ( or anyone else) supports Trump. What are you trying to understand, and what is it that you believe Jon needs to think. I do not always think as Jon does, but in the many threads in which I have disagreed with him I have never perceived him as not thinking.

Personally I hope he stays around.


I need to hear many views. We are already consumed in a "silo culture" that allows us to only hear what we want to hear. We need to hear and appreciate diverse views, even if most of them will not change our minds.
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby KeithE » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:04 pm

JE Pettibone wrote:
KeithE wrote:Jon,

Before you leave (or not), can you answer my question often posed to you - Why do you support Trump?

Free reign - I will not counter whatever you say. Just trying to understand (and make you think).


Ed: And Keith, what is your need to know why Jon ( or anyone else) supports Trump. What are you trying to understand, and what is it that you believe Jon needs to think. I do not always think as Jon does, but in the many threads in which I have disagreed with him I have never perceived him as not thinking.

Personally I hope he stays around.


Like Dave says I like to understand other viewpoints. Several people herein just don’t like the ihatetrump crowd but never say what they like about Trump.

I have asked many people ‘why do you support Trump’ (like here on BL Aug 28, 2018 where Jon and many others never answered). Just giving him (or anyone herein who would like to comment) a chance to speak their minds.

I reported some local comments I received to this question in the link above - reread it. Update on my bridge partner: he is getting to be more disgruntled with Trump’s lying and as he said “his misfocus on defending himself” - "that is never a good sign”.
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby Haruo » Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:08 am

Maybe Jon doesn't see himself as a supporter or liker of Trump.
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Re: Global Refugees

Postby Haruo » Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:10 am

I think he's gone, but hope he will be back.
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