Need a "required reading list"

[linda]

I'm realizing my knowledge of Baptist history and of Baptist theology are skewed to the fundamentalists and to only SBC history and writers, and that fairly recent (say from 1960 on). I have a little bit of stuff from Hodges and Mullins, but that is about all that isn't strongly fundamentalist.

Now's your chance--to get a more balanced view, what would you recommend I read?

[Mark]

[Big Daddy Weaver]

Well, I'm biased obviously but I recommend my dad's survey of Baptist history published in 2008 by Mercer University Press. It is titled .

It's under 300 pages, closer to 250 I think, and has received positive reviews. Randall Balmer has reviewed it although not sure if that review has been published yet. I know of several colleges and seminaries that are using or have used the text in church history courses, Baptist and non-Baptist alike. The book also includes a nice, useful annotated bibliography.

I like the McBeth book. It's a classic, no doubt about that. But it's like 1000 pages or so and I'm sure overwhelms many readers. I tend to use it as a resource - it's like an encyclopedia but not the kind of book you read while in bed (too heavy!)....

[Mark]

[Bruce Gourley]

Linda,

In regards to general Baptist survey volumes, I'd also recommend Doug Weaver's , as well as the Durso's , and Bill Leonard's . And my newest book, , is available as of this month (it is a 128 page overview of Baptist history).

Bruce

[Dave Roberts]

My recommendation would be Bill Leonard's Baptist Ways because it deals with the messiness of being Baptist and because it does get to Baptist history outside the United States which some other books do not do or only mention as part of discussing Baptist missions. Torbet and McBeth are also valuable reads.

[linda]

Thanks--I'll try interlibrary loan first with this list, then as I can perhaps more from Amazon. Once in a while I find good stuff at garage sales, but somehow I doubt this list is going to be in this town.

Keep challenging me!

[Ed Pettibone]

[Blake]

As far as overviews go I'll add my endorsement to Leonard's Baptist Ways. It has much more breadth than previous histories and treats the historical genesis of the Baptists with a seriousness that, for whatever reason, didn't interest McBeth. As for Baptist theology, James Leo Garrett's Baptist Theology: A Four Century Study is the best around at the moment which isn't saying much (it's not bad but it could have been much better) since it's very Southern Baptist leaning. A thorough, current, inclusive overview of Baptist theologians has yet to be done. If you want to go more in depth on particular eras and places you'll have to get into more specialized literature, which abounds and can be very difficult to get ahold of depending on the subject. Nevertheless, feel free to ask for more specific areas of Baptist research and I'm sure people around here can help.

[Ed Pettibone]

[Blake]

Ed, I would call that an OK attempt at a comprehensive presentation of Baptist theologians. As many reviewers noted, there is an obvious bias towards Southern Baptists many of whom probably would not be mentioned in a more wide ranging version. There are no women in the book and none who lived primarily outside the US an Britain. I'm going to start a new thread where I take suggestions at what would make a good overview of Baptist theologians.

[Blake]

Anyone read A Genetic History of Baptist Thought by William H. Brackney? The scholarly reviews look good for it. My seminary doesn't have a copy though so I can't say whether I think it would be better than George and Dockery's work.

[Stephen Fox]

Linda, for starters I continue there is no better book to put things in perspective than Stricklin's a Geneaology of Dissent; quite inspiring, the kind of book that makes a difference.

[Ed Pettibone]

[Big Daddy Weaver]

The Baptist Life and Thought book referenced by Ed is an edited collection of primary source material.

Brackney's Genetic History is not a primary source text.

Genetic History puts a great deal of focus on Northern Baptists and Canadian Baptists. So, it's quite different from other texts which overemphasize the Southern Baptist story.

Anyone read the new book by James Leo Garrett on the history of Baptist theology? I hear it's nearly 800 pages or so!

[Ed Pettibone]

[Big Daddy Weaver]

I'm suggesting that most people are probably not interested in cozying up to a 800 page book.

[Blake]

[Ed Pettibone]

ED: Blake, as Aaron (Big Dady) Weaver said of Garrett's latest book in the post just before yours "most people are probably not interested in cozying up to a 800 page book." And yet you suggest that Garrett omits far too much. Writers and publishers to be profitable have to consider what audience they want, need and hope to reach. Not always are these three the same.

Personally my first problem with large books is they are expensive, secondly due to my arthritis I have real difficulty handling them and thirdly few writers write well enough to hold my attention for more than an hour at a time . If I did come across what I believed was an excellent 800-900 page history of Baptist that I found interesting enough to purchase. I would literally cut it up and rebind it into two or three volumes.

I tend to think it is a blessing that The George and Dockery's edited work and Brackney's Life and Thought. Compliment each other as well as they do. I will not however venture a guess as to how much of the the gigantic iceberg called Church History they cover. I do think we are agreed that Baptist History alone does not account for any vast portion of the visible tip. So I am content to keep on reading and buying ones that come to my attention only if they seem to offer some new perspective, especially as they pertain to my personal interest.

I have no idea how many books on Baptist history that i have in my personal library. As guide posts I have several of Leonard's, and some as old as an original Memorials of Baptist Martyrs By J. Newton Brown, American Baptist Publication Society, Philadelphia, 1854 and have our host, Bruce Gourley's, newest book on order. I have to admit I have none other than a few missions books and American histories that address Baptist in other parts of the world with less than great depth. And worse I have generally skimmed over those parts rather hurriedly. I may need to return to some of those missions books. How ever I am not a Historian. I am a generalist and the closest I have come to being an expert in any thing church related was in Singles Ministry,( my first love) and I have not been very close to that area in the past eight or more years. Or in other words since my wife became a pastor.

[Blake]

Ed, we're really not talking about books people should read cover to cover. These are essentially reference works. The only people that would read these kinds of works cover to cover are hobbyists and a few specialists which are likely a small minority of people buying the books. The common buyer is probably buying it as a reference work to read as it relates to some temporary interest or project.

My contention is that it is insufficient as a general reference work. It's not just that Garrett omits too much, but that he also was not selective enough with his favorite topics: Southern Baptists and reformed baptists. Garrett has limited his market far more by making a Baptist theological history for reformed and Southern Baptists than he would if he had been much more selective with those and filled out the rest of the story a lot more. Had Garrett omitted a third to a fourth of the material on Southern Baptists and reformed baptists and instead used that space to develop the global historical development of baptist theology then we'd have a book in our hands that would be a must have for all serious theological libraries and all baptist students of history and theology. There are always going to be books around to tell one side of the story in better depth, but why don't baptists have any scholars trying to tell a broad inclusive story?

[Ed Pettibone]

[Blake]

Ed, I agree with you about Leonard. I endorsed his Baptist Ways in my first post on this thread for that very reason. I'm more lamenting our present state of Baptist scholarship from the historical theology POV than history generally. I'm not familiar with the Comby works you mentioned though they appear to be quite dated now. Looking at the TOC from Amazon they end with Vatican II and appear to be purely Western histories(?). Not sure if it's supposed to be history or historiography or what but it doesn't look very inclusive from the TOC. Maybe the content is better than the appearance of the structure. When it comes to historical scholarship even in the realms of mission and theology I'd consider Irvin and Sunquist's History of the World Christian Movement to be about as close to the ideal as anyone has yet managed. It is truly broad and inclusive. We've got most of the draft for the second volume to be published in our library for our History of Christianity 2 course to use. I can't wait until they finally finish and publish it.

[Ed Pettibone]

Blake, this site seems to say the work you are awaiting is available in two Volumes, http://hwcmweb.org/

Well that site offers both volumes but the 2nd ordering link does not work.

[Tim Dahl]

If you can find copies, I would recommend two little books to read in addition to those already mentioned.

John Allen Moore wrote: "Baptist Mission Portraits," and "Anabaptist Portraits." I'm not saying that there is a direct lineage between the Anabaptists and Baptists, but they are both really good reads.

Tim

[Big Daddy Weaver]

A new Baptist book which I have provided an endorsement for is titled This is What a Preacher Looks Like: Sermons By Baptist Women in Ministry, edited by Pam Durso.

Chuck Poole, Brett Younger, Susan Sparks, Gordon Atkinson, Carolyn Crumpler, Daniel Aleshire and Carol Howard Merritt have also endorsed this new book which you can read about .