Lets keep CBF policy and polity CBF centered

[Ed Pettibone]

In a another current thread on this site there is a link to an ABP article in which Colleen Burroughs calls for further discussion about the organizations response to homosexuals. In subsequent post discussing this idea there have been comments about UMC, the SBC and Catholics do or have reacted to this question. While what those other groups have is experienced may inform our future actions it my studied opinion that CBF and it partners need to be heard first and develop some consensus before discussion the practices of others .

It is true, as Tim Bonney points out that even I mention the ABC-USA. But Tim ascribes incorrect motives for my making room for ABC-USA but not the UMC , SBC, and Catholics in the discussion. My reason for including ABC-USA is that we in CBF and ABC-USA have close working relationships. For example, my wife has served as a regional representative on the CBF National coordinating council while serving as an ABC-USA pastor. Our ABC-USA church hosted the Baptist Fellowship of the Northeast for the spring meeting last Spring. (see story in Baptists Today p34 July 2011 edition) At that meeting one of the BFNE present National Coordinating council members asked John Pierce who was our featured speaker about where he sees CBF going with this question. As I understood John's answer he sees need for a great deal of further discussion within CBF recognizing that it is a divisive issue that is not going away by ignoring it. Note, that is my summary which did not put in quotation marks. It is my understanding of what he said in about three minutes. And although John was born and raised in Georgia and has lived there most of his life he does not speak slowly, Also he was raised across the Street for Roy Medley who is the Secretary General of the ABC-USA. in other words ABC's top guiding official.

Also as I have reported on other occasions, being incorporated in Massachuts our regional CBF group, BFNE, is not permitted to use cooperative in our title because that term is limited by law to utilities and farm organizations. But indeed BFNE is CBF. BTW the church Trudy pastors is not dully aligned, Trudy and I are the only two who actively participate in CBF. We do have an ABC-USA church up the road that the pastor tells me is also a CBF church.

[Timothy Bonney]

In a another current thread on this site there is a link to an ABP article in which Colleen Burroughs calls for further discussion about the organizations response to homosexuals. In subsequent post discussing this idea there have been comments about UMC, the SBC and Catholics do or have reacted to this question. While what those other groups have is experienced may inform our future actions it my studied opinion that CBF and it partners need to be heard first and develop some consensus before discussion the practices of others .

So are you saying that you need to make up your mind before you look at any of the options anyone else has looked at? Sorry Ed, that sounds like an insular approach to polity. Please correct me if I'm reading you wrong. But it sounds like you are saying that the CBF folks need to come to a consensus before they talk to anyone about it who isn't CBF. How is that helpful to the CBF coming to a consensus?

Hey, if you don't want my opinion that is ok. I'll bow out of the conversation. But I'll say before I do that the CBF will not benefit from trying to re-invent the wheel. All Christian groups are dealing with this issue in one form or another. Choosing not to look at how others are handling (or not handling) the issue is just missing possible valuable information.

[Ed Pettibone]

In a another current thread on this site there is a link to an ABP article in which Colleen Burroughs calls for further discussion about the organizations response to homosexuals. In subsequent post discussing this idea there have been comments about how UMC, the SBC and Catholics do or have reacted to this question. While what those other groups have is experienced may inform our future actions it my studied opinion that CBF and it partners need to be heard first and develop some consensus before discussion the practices of others .

So are you saying that you need to make up your mind before you look at any of the options anyone else has looked at?

Ed: And Tim where Have I said that. Please do not put words in my fingers.

Tim: Sorry Ed, that sounds like an insular approach to polity. Please correct me if I'm reading you wrong. But it sounds like you are saying that the CBF folks need to come to a consensus before they talk to anyone about it who isn't CBF. How is that helpful to the CBF coming to a consensus?

Ed: Yes Tim, I believe WE (CBF) need to come to a consensus as to where WE are. I am quite aware of serious disconnects among us on this issue and I have seen something of what the UMC and others are doing. I do know of churches across denominational lines that I would judge as handling it well but i know of NO denomination that is doing so. When I say handling it well. I am not talking about those who are totally exclusionary of homosexuals. And certainly not those who are fully accepting of homosexual activity.

Tim: Hey, if you don't want my opinion that is ok. I'll bow out of the conversation. But I'll say before I do that the CBF will not benefit from trying to re-invent the wheel. All Christian groups are dealing with this issue in one form or another. Choosing not to look at how others are handling (or not handling) the issue is just missing possible valuable information.

Ed: Tim you are still putting words in my fingers. I am always open to your "opinions" But do not appreciate your errant mind reading regarding my motives. Nor I am always in agreement with the opinions of UMC leadership. If I where I would be UMC, because neither am I always in agreement with ABC-USA leadership of which I am part. The same is true of CBF although at present I have no leadership position there. And I am of the opinion that Baptist leadership is unique in not demanding that people rubber stamp an individuals or a boards ideas any where above the local church. with in the local church those who can not abide by the church decision need to move on. As I said in Denver at the 2005 ABC-USA Biennial, I also believe that churches that are accepting of homosexual practice need to form their own relationships Out side the present denominational structures. The Alliance of Baptist has open arms. Again please read what I say not what you fear I may say.

[Stephen Fox]

Fresh Air on Zionism:

One thing I think CBF, like this secular Jew, can center on:

[quoteGROSS: So you attend an Orthodox synagogue and send your children to a Jewish school. Why do you send your children to a Jewish school?

BEINART: I believe that the foundation of Jewish commitment is Jewish education. I believe what I most want for my children is knowledge of joy in and fascination with Judaism. And I believe if they are given that then I will have discharged my duty to them and given them the tools they need to have a meaningful relationship with Judaism and - God willing - to pass it on to their children and grandchildren. I'm willing to pay a very high price, financially and in other ways, in order to make sure that I ground my children in that foundation.

I critique in my book the American Jewish community actually for not doing enough to support Jewish education because I think it's unrealistic to imagine that we can inculcate Jewish commitment in our children if we haven't given our children a strong foundation educationally in Judaism.

GROSS: But sending your children to a Jewish school means they're not going to a school where they'll be meeting people who aren't like them. I mean, they won't be meeting people who aren't Jewish. And in an age where multiculturalism has become so important, don't you want your children to in school be mingling with, having friends who are different from them - different religions, different ethnic groups, different races?

BEINART: We look for opportunities to do that outside of school and certainly they will - certainly by the time they're in college they'll be at a much more diverse place. But I actually believe that the strongest form of multiculturalism, the most vibrant form of multiculturalism comes through the interactions between people who actually know something about their own tradition and can then speak about it to other people in a meaningful way.

When my children do interact with the non-Jewish world and people say what is it mean to be Jewish? Why do Jews do A, B and C, I want them to be able to speak from a position of knowledge and pride and explain what Judaism is. And I think actually often the most meaningful multicultural encounters come between people who both have strong foundations in their own particular religion or ethnicity or peoplehood. And so that's where I wanted to invest - my wife and I wanted to invest - first with our children.
][/quote]

[Big Daddy Weaver]

Anyone know where Ed's been? Seems like a couple weeks now since I've seen him post. Hope he is well.

[Timothy Bonney]

Anyone know where Ed's been? Seems like a couple weeks now since I've seen him post. Hope he is well.

You know BDW I was wondering that myself. Anyone know?

[Ed Pettibone]

Anyone know where Ed's been? Seems like a couple weeks now since I've seen him post. Hope he is well.

You know BDW I was wondering that myself. Anyone know?

Ed: Hi y'all! It looks like my last post had been on march 9th. I had sent my computer to the shop to get back some tools I had lost when I tried on my own to get rid of sports tool bar that I had added after it quit working, in the process I had lost my BL.Com Password. Hauro reset it for me today.

Also Trudy and I both apparently picked up Severe cases of bronchitis when we where in NYC for the Big East tournament. Or maybe I picked it up first. I ended up having to get off my most effective Arthritis medication (Humira), because it reduces the effectiveness of the immune system thus even the high powered antibiotics where slow taking effect . I am finally going to re-start the Humira tomorrow, so maybe in a few days I can start getting close to a full nights sleep again. But honestly while it has been increasingly uncomfortable I have not had any where near the pain I have previously experienced with the Arthritis.

I have been reading BL.Com and have noted nothing much new. I do want to thank Aaron, Tim and other who noted my absence and special thanks to Haruo for the new password

[Haruo]

Glad you made it back, Ed. Happy Easter.