David Burroughs examines CBF at outset of Paynter era

[Stephen Fox]

http://abpnews.com/opinion/commentaries ... -of-legacy

[Stephen Fox]

I think one thing that will say just what the CBF is made of is how it navigates Immigration reform in realpolitik terms.

Will it be a witness for instance to key house member and Baylor Grad Trey Gowdy, whose membership is with Billy Graham at FBC Spartanburg, S.C.

Harry Dent's daughter Ginny Brant was longtime member there.

Will the CBF with all that road testing in Austin and Texas CLC brings in forming Paynter have the prophetic witness to do at this key moment in immigration reform what we all in hindsight had wished white Baptists woulda done for Civil Rights in the 60's.

The Tea Party underbelly is real. It's connections to the NRA and SBC are strong. Let's me be clear on this matter on a united front.

Hordes of Mexicans in particular were invited to the USA in the 90's with a wink and a nod. And hordes of their children have earned their citizenship already by solid achievement in our public schools. No fines no penalties for them. They vote when they turn 18 or all the Vacation Bible Schools all across S.C. and Mississippi and Alabama and all the talk they got about Jesus was a sham.

Let's be clear and fight the Tea Party House on this matter and tell FBC Spartanburg, Bama Deacon Gov Bentley and whomever.

[Sandy]

[William Thornton]

The New CBF: Alliance Lite

[Dave Roberts]

When no one from CBF churches said anything, I knew my two favorite SBC fans would have to weigh in, even if the comments are weightless .

[Sandy]

Just providing a little objective balance to the ABP's promotional piece.

[William Thornton]

[Stephen Fox]

I may have to hit Thornton up for two BBQ sandwiches after all to put my disgruntlement with his rationale into concrete terms, make him pay as it were.

I was having a chat with a day laborer friend of mine on the way to this station tonight about folks of repute like Bob Woodward and Gergen 2nd guessing President Obama here on the heels of Sequestration.

The analogy fits Thornton on this matter almost perfectly.

Dave Roberts has his number.

Let me throw Sandy in there as well.

It begs the question to be so adept on some matters and then go straight to the gay question when lurching for an Achilles heel of the CBF.

The file on SBC takeover and the Helms Birch Society hardwiring is deeper than a dungpile in Jackson County Georgia with forty cows on five acres.

OTOH, the CBF is plodding along with the best of a deliberative democracy as can be with literate but not elite Baptists who are light years further on pilgrimage in radar for the demagoguery quotient than the SBC.

With leadership informed by the likes of Randall Balmer and Giberson and Stephens, who understand Bonhoeffer in the Charles Marsh Sense as opposed to the Metaxas hijacking they plod along in Kingdom work.

[Stephen Fox]

For folks of dissent on this board of the intelligence of Thornton and Sandy to pick away at the heels of CBF work is disappointing and much more serious than the playful banter we all partake of on this board, the regulars at least.

Disappointed in both of you, but still hold onto a great deal of affection for you Both in The Lord, as they say here in NE Bama.

[TrudyU]

[William Thornton]

[TrudyU]

[Dave Roberts]

[Sandy]

[TrudyU]

[Sandy]

The sexuality conference was the only CBF event he mentioned, at the very outset, in an article about where CBF is going at the outset of the Paynter issue. I think he made his perspective perfectly clear. He could have come right out and said, "I surely hope that CBF is heading in the direction that the outcome of the conference suggested that it needs to go," but direct talk about these kinds of issues hasn't been as effective. I think its pretty clear.

Montoya has been a Methodist pastor for over a year now.

[TrudyU]

[Sandy]

Conferences used as Burroughs suggests, as "forums for discussion of difficult issues" are an informal means of getting Baptist groups to move in a particular direction, and have been for a long, long time. Calling a conference, or getting a "meeting" together about a particular issue, especially when someone with some influence wanted action on it, is a long standing way of either signalling those on the trustee boards that something needs to be done, or convincing enough people that they need to get to the next annual meeting to do something about it. This particular conference was classic in that sense, independently organized, timed to take place just after the issue of CBF's anti-gay hiring policy was being discussed by the moderator and some coordinating council members very openly and publicly, following the announcement that the current exec director, perceived to be one of the strongest supporterrs of the policy, was retiring, and as you observed, Ed, generally more liberal on the subject than most of CBF, as you see it, but with just enough of an opposing view to make it look fair and balanced.

Without rehashing the whole discussion about the conference, of course any discussion of the church and sexuality these days will involve homosexuality. However, the general tone of this particular conference was done from a perspective that, if accepted, would require CBF to change its policy.

Of all of the forums, discussions, dialogues and events Burroughs could have used to illustrate his point, he picked just one, this one. And he dropped it in his discussion of the "insightfulness" of CBF's early leaders in valuing networks and partnerships. I think its pretty clear what he is saying, and that is his hope that CBF's new leader will be bold and insighful and use the networks and partnerships rather than the general assembly and the structure to make a sweeping change in CBF's policy toward persons of homosexual orientation. I think he thinks she's the person. Now, in the obfuscating, "churchy", religious toned lingo that people in denominational and Christian organizational leadership use to avoid saying anything controversial, you might not get a direct statement to that effect. They'll want to wait and see how the kite flies, so to speak.

[William Thornton]

I do not buy all of Sandy's stuff on some matters, but I think he is on target here. Just wait and watch.

[Dave Roberts]

Having been a part of CBF since the first organizational meeting in the Omni in Atlanta and having served on a state coordinating council, I have my doubts on Sandy's analysis. The proof, however, will be in the way things play out, not in the speculations of either friends or foes.

[TrudyU]

[Big Daddy Weaver]

Here are the COMPLETE proceedings of the sexuality and covenant conference made available free and online by Christian Ethics Today and CET editor (and interim CBF exec coordinator) Pat Anderson

and you'll see it was a very balanced conference, despite claims to the contrary.

[Stephen Fox]

I think it is a mistake for Aaron to take the sex bait in this conversation. Sexual politics are just a smidgeon of whats on Suzii Paynter's plate and ultimately like abortion are a distraction to the weight of Kingdom work in front of Ms. Paynter.

Immigration reform for one as she focusses on the main task of deepening the community among various CBF constituencies and inclinations.

[Big Daddy Weaver]

Not taking any bait. This latest issue of CET just came out a handful of weeks ago. Instead of assumptions and assertions, folks (who were too lazy to watch the videos earlier) can now read every word that was uttered at that conference.

[TrudyU]